Author: Peter McKenzie
Date: 16:56:52 04/30/01
Go up one level in this thread
On April 30, 2001 at 11:21:49, Vincent Diepeveen wrote: >On April 30, 2001 at 10:59:03, Ed Schröder wrote: > >>On April 30, 2001 at 10:29:14, Vincent Diepeveen wrote: >> >>>On April 30, 2001 at 10:01:09, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>> >>>>On April 30, 2001 at 07:22:24, Alvaro Polo wrote: >>>> >>>>>Hello all, >>>>> >>>>>In a recent interview Kramnik states that "We are in a very interesting phase, >>>>>when the strength of the best GMs and that of the best chess engines run by the >>>>>best processors are about equal." >>>>> >>>>>I know that this point (machines being GM strenght or nor) has been debated >>>>>again and again and I don't intend to post a troll. I would just like to know if >>>>>the consensus now among chess programmers is wether Kramnik is right or not. For >>>>>instance, I remember Bob Hyatt saying that computers are really 2450, etc. But >>>>>software evolves, CPU power evolves and perhaps now there is agreement that >>>>>machines are finally GM strenght? >>>>> >>>>>Thanks. >>>>> >>>>>Alvaro Polo >>>> >>>> >>>>I personally think my estimate is still pretty close. Computers have two >>>>serious problems: >>>> >>>>1. opening books. They depend on a human to "play the game" of choosing good >>>>and bad openings. This leaves them highly vulnerable to opening preparation and >>>>traps. Particularly when you practice against one copy and then play another >>>>copy which doesn't have the 'learning' from the practice games. >>>> >>>>2. blocked positions and slow build-ups in kingside attacks. Hardly anyone >>>>has made progress in fighting either of these problems. And they _still_ offer >>>>good chances for a GM that is willing to employ them. >>> >>>I completely agree here. Add to that that if you can remember which program >>>you practiced against cq studied very well, that you then also know what >>>kind of positoinal knowledge the prog doesn't know. >>> >>>Some progs lack simplistic positional knowledge. Playing progs in general >>>is not such a cool idea, you need to know indepth knowledge of the program >>>you play to win from it. >>> >>>At least with 2285 national i need to know that. >> >>Do you want to play a match Vincent :-) >> >>Ed > >What was it, 250$ for each point scored versus rebel? > >Under those conditions of course! Ed, please make this match happen. You could market it as 'Computer chess expert takes on Rebel' or something similar. I really think it would be an interesting match, I've seen Vincent play blitz verse programs on ICC and he is quite dangerous. Peter
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