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Subject: Re: Chess and O(1)

Author: Jesper Antonsson

Date: 02:46:24 05/10/01

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On May 09, 2001 at 18:28:13, Robert Hyatt wrote:

It seems I cannot restrain myself, I just have to answer one more time. :-)

>I am not sure what you mean.  There is no "linear" list of chess positions
>in any way I can think of using "linear".  The complexity issue simply asks
>"how hard will it be to compute this function if I increase the number of
>inputs by 1?"  In the case of chess, an "input" is a "ply"...

Yes, agreed.

>How do you define "deep enough?"  If we could prove that white wins within 80
>plies, then that would do it.  but so far, we have not proven that.  And since
>the game isn't over until mate or stalemate occurs, unless the two players
>decide to call it a draw for various reasons, I'm not ready to say it is
>"finite" until someone offers reasonable proof that it is...

Great, then, hopefully, this is *the* point where we disagree. Now, the 3-fold
repetition rule and 50-move rule are not mandatory, but they are there. How do
you handle these positions in the search in Crafty (your "algorithm")? I would
assume that you label them a draw and search no deeper. Perhaps you do not
always *claim* the draw when such a position is at the root, but, as I said, you
probably treat them as draws in the search. This is because mini-max "assumes"
best play from both sides, and either the position is a draw whether 3/50 rules
are used or not, in which case it is safe to return draw-score, or the player
that is losing, using "best play", should claim the draw, in which case minimax
should also return a draw score.

So, from a search perspective, or solving-chess-perspective, we should treat
these positions as draws, and when we do, a "good" chess algorithm in theory
stops it's exponential behaviour at a certain depth.



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