Author: Miguel A. Ballicora
Date: 09:09:22 05/23/01
Go up one level in this thread
On May 22, 2001 at 13:07:29, Robert Hyatt wrote: >On May 22, 2001 at 10:09:03, Miguel A. Ballicora wrote: > >>On May 22, 2001 at 02:31:37, Uri Blass wrote: >> >>>On May 22, 2001 at 01:40:05, Miguel A. Ballicora wrote: >>> >>>>On May 22, 2001 at 00:02:01, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>>> >>>>>On May 21, 2001 at 15:18:36, Ingo Bauer wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>Here is the right diagram: >>>>>> >>>>>>[D]2r2rk1/p1q1bpp1/1p6/n2R4/8/P4N2/1B2QPPP/5RK1 w - - >>>>>> >>>>>>Following Kasparov, Bxg7 is the winning move. Its from a Game Kasparov - >>>>>>Poritsch 1983. More infos about the complete Test at: >>>>>>http://mitglied.tripod.de/ChessBits/index.html >>>>>>And the un the buttom line GS290. Its in German but the Test should be >>>>>>understandable. >>>>>> >>>>>>Ingo >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>Would be funny if DB Jr is right. Be nice to tell him "who" found the >>>>>"best" move there. :) >>>> >>>>This line is facinating, there are some hidden tactics that are not in the PV >>>>that are beautiful, for instance at the end, instead of Qa8, Qb7 looks better >>>>but Ng6!! is excellent (Qxe7/ Nxe7+ Kh7/ Rh5#) and if Rb8 / Rh5! fxg6/ Qe6+ Qf7 >>>>/Rh8+ +- (Carbon analysis). >>>>White is threatening at all times Qh4 and it is nice how the white pieces >>>>coordinate to threat Rh8# and have everythind defended. That is why Black >>>>manouver to force the white king to be in h4. >>>> >>>>BUT, Bxg7 is a winning move, no doubt about it, and easier for a human to >>>>evaluate. >>> >>>I have clear doubts if Bxg7 is winning. >>> >>>Can you give me a tree that proves that white has clearly more than +1 >>>evaluation. >>> >>>Uri >> >>The game itself looks convincing to me. >>Bxg7 Kxg7/ Ne5 Rfd8/Qg4+ Kf8/Qf5! f6/ Nd7+ Rxd7/ Rxd7 >>Material is balanced but the knight is out of the game for a couple of moves >>and the unsafety of the King should count for +1.00 at least. Q+R+R against >>a naked king is bad... Black has a lot of problems and suffer terribly through >>light squares. >> >>Regards, >>Miguel > >I played thru the moves above for white, and after that last Rxd7, Crafty gives >Qe5 with a slight plus for white, not "winning" at all. IE after depth=13, the >score is +.33, goes up slightly at 14. > > 13 1:27 0.33 6. ... Qe5 7. Qh3 Rc7 8. Rd3 f5 9. > Qh6+ Qg7 10. Qf4 Rc3 11. Rd7 Qg5 12. > Qb8+ Kf7 13. Re1 Nc6 > (2) 13-> 2:19 0.33 6. ... Qe5 7. Qh3 Rc7 8. Rd3 f5 9. > Qh6+ Qg7 10. Qf4 Rc3 11. Rd7 Qg5 12. > Qb8+ Kf7 13. Re1 Nc6 > 14 4:08 0.45 6. ... Qe5 7. Qh3 Rc7 8. Rd3 f5 9. > Qh6+ Qg7 10. Qf4 Rc5 11. Qb8+ Kf7 12. > Qxa7 Nc4 13. Rg3 Qd4 14. Re1 > >Rh5 seems better although I couldn't get DB Jr's score of +1.5 in any reasonable Ok, Qe5 convince me that a clear win is not easy. Still the position is much better for white but the line found with Rh5 is better. Qe5 has the ability to support Rc3 if needed. For instance, when White plays Rd3 as in the game. Bxg7 is more natural for a human. Rh5 looks awkward until you see that the queen is going to h4 after taking the bishop. Rh5 is less forced, so there tons of lines to take care of... Regards, Miguel >time (two hours or so). > >I guess this leads to Uri's question (again) of "does Bxg7 actually win or >not?"
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