Author: Vincent Diepeveen
Date: 18:54:47 05/29/01
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On May 29, 2001 at 21:09:23, Chessfun wrote: >On May 29, 2001 at 13:02:43, Vincent Diepeveen wrote: > >> round 3 : Ferret - diep 1-0 >> >>Diep played Najdorf and got itself a splendid position despite that >>the number of variations in my tournament book is not so big. >>However bad luck struck for diep this time. Something went wrong >>with king safety and diep walked its king into the center. Now despite >>that Ferret kept on playing nullmoves and my score went high. So >>i assume somewhere there a penalty must have had a plus instead of >>a minus. Perhaps i'll figure it out tonight. Anyway. Playing with a rook >>less lost quick for DIEP though. Complete crush after playing with that >>rook less. Great debug info though! > >> round 8 : crafty - diep 0-1 > >>But to get to the game. Same line as against ferret up to 12th move >>of black. I was pretty amazed >>actually. Any automatic generated book would have played in poisened pawn >>the Qd2 move allowing me to get a REAL poisened pawn by taking on b2. >> >>However crafty played Nb3. I DEFINITELY like to know why, because a >>posting of Bob: >> Posted by Robert Hyatt (Profile) on May 28, 2001 at 00:46:07: >> >> " >> [snip] >> >> > >> >It shouldn't be the case that someone signs a contract with >> >ChessBase and then >> >sighs with relief because they know they're going to gain >> >an extra couple of >> >points at the next tournament, because they can use >> >opening book technology >> >shared by all of the Chessbase products. >> > >> >bruce >> >> I won't disagree. But it is already happening. If I ever play >> in what I consider an important event, it will be one of my >> goals to take some sort of evasive action, book-wise. >> Or take my main goal: to make hand-tuned books >> obsolete. I believe that is possible over time. >> I'm going to try to do it." >> >>Oh well obviously crafty isn't playing with a non-hand tuned thing here, >>because any automatic generated book will see that after >> e4 c5 nf3 d6 d4 cd nd4 nf6 nc3 a6 bg5 e6 f4 qb6 >> a) 8.Nb3 has a bad score for white >> b) 8.Qd2 is played way more times and has a better score for >> white. > >According to DeepFritz.ctg the chance of 8. Nb3 is 15.2% and only >actually has a performance difference of -6 2547 v 2553. I never >checked other books but would assume similar percentages. Well according to bob i should get the salt :) >>But main factor is that Qd2 is at least 10 times more played as Nb3, >>which will render any thought of playing Nb3 useless! > >Not useless just less. >>Anyway my surprise became even BIGGER, when the exact same line as >>against ferret came onto the board. Only at move 13 a different move >>was selected, probably even better as the book move played by ferret. >> >>If that's non-hand tuned then i'll eat my hat! > >What makes you think that 13. Qh3 is such a good move? >Ferret's 13. a3 looks better. a3 goes to an =+ line. Qg3 dunno. it just frightened me. >>Anyway, DIEP frightened its programmer here by quickly castling, but after >>a few nullmoves of crafty, things were very clear in favour for diep then. > >I would like to have read more of your thoughts on both these games. >However great reading your thoughts on all matches !. thanks! >Some of your comments though as the following I feel should be a >little less open or maybe spirited. I could also write that Mr J.E.F. Kaan tried some years ago to sell me some things which i didn't accept as being acceptible and if someone would do the same today to me like that then i would go to my already well paid lawyer and ask him what steps we could take as i felt that someone was trying to swindle me. >>2400 7814059 Kaan J.E.F. M 1245* 14- >> >>Now compare that with a 1245 rated 'born loser' Jan Kaan who >>played in I-CSVN with Yace with his own home made book. Of >>course that book doesn't make a chance, not to mention that >>it lost strategically in every line for Yace! >> >>Because that is the bitter reality. Now you don't need too much rating >>yourself to make a good book, as making a book is completely different >>from playing chess in a tournament. >> >>However, some strategical insight is at least needed to make a book. >>I know some 1200 rated KNSB players who play correspondence chess and >>manage to get good openings positions there, but of course Jan Kaan >>is completely chanceless against guys who DEFINITELY know strategics >>a bit like Pesce who made a book for Yace and Pharaon. >> >> 105872 Pesce, Carlos ARG 2045 0 19.04.61 >> >>I'm really amazed that programmer of Yace allowed Jan1245 to delete >>at home the very good Pesce book and replace it by a Jan Kaan >>"automatic generated beginners book". >> >>Because strategically Jan Kaan is of course infinitely and with >>induction to forever worse than Pesce, who is at a chess level that >>he might outbook any IM and some GMs also. >> >>'Kaan automatic generated beginner books' > >What details do you have on the Kaan book to call it a beginner book. More as i can write down here, but in order to prevent lengthy discussions let's not get into details. better you ask Mr Jan E.F. Kaan. >First you say "Because that is the bitter reality. Now you don't need too much >rating yourself to make a good book, as making a book is completely different >from playing chess in a tournament." Then critique the book, one which you >probably haven't analyzed. If you knew Jan just a bit better as you know him now you would swallow your words and get happy if the man leaves the chessscene. Some people shouldn't be allowed in. This is an opinion of course, not a truth. >Just seems like a personal attack to me. >Even the comments about Patzer I thought were harsh at times. Yes, especially meant for Frank Quisinsky who nowadays tries to earn some i heart. Perhaps in order to sell better some selfwritten cdroms he already in advance announced Patzer would easily win I-CSVN. I can be wrong of course, but for sure it didn't win the I-CSVN and Franks was fanatically disappointed in that it didn't win it, perhaps bad for his sales, who knows. Probably i see things which aren't true, in that case i apologize for it! For sure is that the cdroms were written at a too high speed burner... >However as usual your posts do make for a fun read ! Thanks! >Sarah.
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