Author: Sune Larsson
Date: 03:23:13 08/19/01
Go up one level in this thread
On August 19, 2001 at 00:03:10, Uri Blass wrote:
>On August 18, 2001 at 18:03:53, Sune Larsson wrote:
>
>>On August 18, 2001 at 16:14:19, Dieter Buerssner wrote:
>>
>>>On August 18, 2001 at 15:18:32, Sune Larsson wrote:
>>>
>>>> 8/pR4pk/1b6/2p5/N1p5/8/PP1r2PP/6K1 b - - 0 1
>>>>
>>>> Ortueta - Sanz, 1934
>>>
>>>Nice to see this position. It was sent to me by Carlos Pesce, who is also a
>>>regular at this forum, perhaps almost a year ago.
>>>
>>>My current developement version of Yace, AMD K6-2 475, 20M hash needs 1:45:
>>>
>>> 1497226 9.701 -0.12 9. 1...c3 2.bxc3 Rxa2 3.Nxb6 axb6 4.Rxb6 Ra3 5.Rc6
>>> Rxc3
>>> 1693487 10.698 -0.22 10t 1...c3 2.bxc3 Rxa2 3.Nxb6 axb6 4.Rxb6 Ra3 5.c4
>>> Rc3 6.Rc6 Rxc4 7.Kf2 Rc3H 8.g4H {HT}
>>> 1946017 12.217 -0.21 10t+ 1...Bd8 2.Rxa7 Bf6 3.Rb7 Bd4+ 4.Kf1 Rf2+ 5.Ke1
>>> Rxg2 6.Nxc5 Bxc5 7.Rb5 {270}
>>> 2458940 15.380 -0.11 10t 1...Bd8 2.Rxa7 Bf6 3.Rb7 Bd4+ 4.Kf1 Rf2+ 5.Ke1
>>> Rxg2 6.h3 Rh2 7.Rb5 g6 {10}
>>> 2926399 18.128 -0.11 10. 1...Bd8 2.Rxa7 Bf6 3.Rb7 Bd4+ 4.Kf1 Rf2+ 5.Ke1
>>> Rxg2 6.h3 Rh2 7.Rb5 g6 {10}
>>> 4866538 30.034 -0.10 11t 1...Bd8 2.Rxa7 Bf6 3.Rb7 Bd4+ 4.Kf1 Rf2+ 5.Ke1
>>> Rxg2 6.h3 Rh2 7.Rb5 Kg6 8.h4 {10}
>>> 6251300 38.072 -0.10 11. 1...Bd8 2.Rxa7 Bf6 3.Rb7 Bd4+ 4.Kf1 Rf2+ 5.Ke1
>>> Rxg2 6.h3 Rh2 7.Rb5 Kg6 8.h4 {10}
>>> 13214562 1:21.1 -0.09 12t 1...Bd8 2.h3 Bf6 3.Kf1 Bd4 4.g3 Rf2+ 5.Ke1 a6
>>> 6.Ra7 Rh2 7.Rxa6 Bxb2 8.Nxb2 Rxb2 {HT} {0}
>>> 17224255 1:44.6 -0.08 12t+ 1...Rxb2 2.Nxb2 c3 3.Rxb6 c4 4.Rb4 a5 5.Rxc4
>>> cxb2 6.Rh4+ Kg6 7.Kf2 b1=Q 8.Kf3 {421}
>>> 17819072 1:47.9 0.30 12++ 1...Rxb2 2.Nxb2 c3 3.Rxb6 c4 4.Rb4 a5 5.Rxc4
>>> cxb2 6.Rh4+ Kg6 7.Kf2 b1=Q 8.Kf3 {421}
>>> 20309569 2:02.6 1.56 12t 1...Rxb2 2.Nxb2 c3 3.Rxb6 c4 4.Rb4 a5 5.Nd3
>>> cxd3 6.Rh4+ Kg8 7.Rc4 d2 8.Rc8+ Kf7 9.Rd8 {-420}
>>> 20518471 2:03.9 1.56 12. 1...Rxb2 2.Nxb2 c3 3.Rxb6 c4 4.Rb4 a5 5.Nd3
>>> cxd3 6.Rh4+ Kg8 7.Rc4 d2 8.Rc8+ Kf7 9.Rd8 {-420}
>>> 27089623 2:42.1 1.89 13t 1...Rxb2 2.Nxb2 c3 3.Rxb6 c4 4.Rb4 a5 5.Rb5 c2
>>> 6.Kf2 c1=Q 7.Ke2 Qg1 8.Kf3 {HT} {161}
>>> 29913694 2:58.8 1.89 13. 1...Rxb2 2.Nxb2 c3 3.Rxb6 c4 4.Rb4 a5 5.Rb5 c2
>>> 6.Kf2 c1=Q 7.Ke2 Qg1 8.Kf3 {HT} {161}
>>>
>>>Some versions of Yace find it at depth 11 in about 35 seconds on my computer.
>>>It gave me already a lot of headache, why this is the case (after investigagint
>>>MB long dumps of the search tree) ...
>>>
>>>I add a snippet of the PGN, Carlos sent. I think, he won't mind:
>>>
>>>---
>>>{THE IMPORTANCE OF A PASSED PAWN
>>>This ending was played by two unknown spanish players (Ortueta-Sanz)
>>>but...they seemed the best!}
>>>
>>>[Event "?"]
>>>[Site "?"]
>>>[Date "?"]
>>>[Round "-"]
>>>[White "?"]
>>>[Black "?"]
>>>[Result "*"]
>>>[FEN "8/pR4pk/1b6/2p5/N1p5/8/PP1r2PP/6K1 b - - 0 1"]
>>>[SetUp "1"]
>>>
>>>{--------------
>>>. . . . . . . .
>>>p R . . . . p k
>>>. b . . . . . .
>>>. . p . . . . .
>>>N . p . . . . .
>>>. . . . . . . .
>>>P P . r . . P P
>>>. . . . . . K .
>>>black to play
>>>--------------}
>>>1... Rxb2 {!!} 2. Nxb2 c3 3. Rxb6 {unique! 3. Nd3? c4+ 4. Rxb6 cxd3 5. Rc6
>>>d2!} c4 {!! see! R and N can't detain the pawn} 4. Rb4 a5
>>>*
>>>{Now, thanks to a passed pawn, white can draw in a difficult position:
>>>Black threaten Qxf4 and Qb1+-Qxb4 or Qb1+-Nf1+}
>>>---
>>>
>>>I wonder about one thing. Carlos calls these two unknown players. How is it
>>>possible, that you both found this position independently?
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>Dieter
>>
>>
>>Several reasons, I guess. First, the black player is not that unknown -
>>Jose Sanz Aguado participated in the Spanish team at the Olympics of
>>Prague in 1931. Then he was Spanish Champion of 1943, beating Rey Ardid
>>in a match with 5.5-4.5. Second, this game is well known since the finish
>>is quite spectacular. The whole game is to found in most bases, like f.e
>>Big 2001. Third, this ending is part of the interesting positions of
>>Valentin Albillo. You can find them here:
>>http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/6298/cmain.htm#tests
>>
>>For sure this position should be put in a folder named
>>"Recognizing unstopable pawns", as this is the theme here.
>>Just a tip to Franz Morsch...;-)
>>
>>Sune
>
>I think that this tip is not going to help Franz morsch.
>I believe that Franz knows about this position but correcting one problem may
>create another problem and this is the reason that he does not fix it.
>
>Deep Fritz seems to be the best commercial program in comp-comp games and I
>guess that franz is careful before doing changes.
>
>Uri
I really cannot comment on what Franz might know - what he has tried or
not - or the possible reasons why he hasn't fixed this problem.
Simply because I don't know. But as a fact I notice that Fritz performs
very badly in this position, when it comes to recognizing the unstopable
pawns.
Sune
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