Author: Uri Blass
Date: 14:41:17 08/23/01
Go up one level in this thread
On August 23, 2001 at 13:01:49, Andreas Herrmann wrote: >On August 23, 2001 at 08:13:02, Jouni Uski wrote: > >>On August 23, 2001 at 08:01:56, Jeff Lischer wrote: >> >>>On August 23, 2001 at 05:59:28, Andreas Herrmann wrote: >>> >>>>On August 23, 2001 at 00:20:20, Uri Blass wrote: >>>> >>>>>On August 22, 2001 at 21:35:14, Frank Quisinsky wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>Hi there, >>>>>> >>>>>>my emperiment "Amateurs vs. Professionals" is now over (the right time, WM is >>>>>>running ... good timing :-)) ). >>>>>> >>>>>>You can find all "AP" results in a table in my News Ticker. >>>>>>You can find all 1.440 games in CBH and PGN and a rating list (all engines are >>>>>>playing 180 games). >>>>>> >>>>>>I have a lot of fun with the AP tournaments, maybe I more fun if Gandalf won >>>>>>more tourneys :-)) >>>>>> >>>>>>Amateurs vs. Professionals: >>>>>>http://www.amateurschach.de/schach/cbase/experiment.htm >>>>>> >>>>>>All results available in my News Ticker: >>>>>>http://www.amateurschach.de/news.htm >>>>>> >>>>>>... >>>>>> >>>>>>Have now a nice latest WM day. >>>>>> >>>>>>Best >>>>>>Frank >>>>> >>>>>The result prove that the professionals are clearly better than the amatuers. >>>>>The best amatuer Goliath Light got less points than the worse proffesional >>>>>Nimzo8. >>>>> >>>>>It seems that in a tournament of 180 games the amatuers have no practical chance >>>>>to win. >>>>> >>>>>Uri >>>> >>>>Yes in 180 game tournaments (the statistical error is very low), but in a 9 game >>>>tournament like the WMCCC 2001 there is nearby all possible. In Frank's test, >>>>the amateurs wins 3 of 20 tournaments. In his tournaments Fritz is the strongest >>>>engine, but it wins only 4 or 5 times. >>>> >>>>Andreas >>> >>>Also, Tiger was the 2nd strongest engine, but finished tied for 14th-15th in one >>>tournament -- a tournament won by the 11th strongest SOS. Frank's experiment >>>really highlights how *anything* can happen in short tournaments like WMCCC. >>> >> >>But I have feeling, that with longer time control (as in Maastrich) surprises >>are less likely. Frank's tournament was 40/10 I think. >> >>Jouni > > >No, my opinion is, that the chance to get a halv or a full point against a >stronger program is in longer time controls better for the weaker program. > >In blitz games programs reaches a depth of about 6 to 11 plys. In tournamnet >games with for excample 40 moves in 120 minutes they reaches about 15 or more >plys. If a weaker reaches about 1 ply less than the stronger one, it is more bad >in blitz games. You forget that the difference is not a constant. It may be 1 ply at blitz and 2 or 3 plies at tournament time control. The difference is also in the evaluation and not only in the search Uri
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