Author: Uri Blass
Date: 08:13:08 09/01/01
Go up one level in this thread
On September 01, 2001 at 09:55:25, Robert Hyatt wrote: >On September 01, 2001 at 08:48:00, Vincent Diepeveen wrote: > >> >>You are entirely right Ed, i have singular extensions inside diep now >>and play with them turned on tournaments now. first tournament i played >>with them turned on was back in 1994 the dutch open championship, >>but my implementation sucked bigtime there. Then in paderborn 2001 i >>used a better implementation with big reduction factor (R=3) and >>also in combination with other extensions. The reason i have them >>inside diep now is >> a) diep doesn't search very deeply so overhead isn't too big then >> b) to solve testpositions quicker otherwise i need days to solve things >> >>However what i notice is that in mainlines in complex positions the >>value of singular extensions is very limited. Of course if i'm already >>won i see mates way before my opponent sees them (in middlegame) or >>i see a win way before my opponent sees it, as well as that Rxf7 move >>which ferret played against gandalf i see within seconds with within 90 >>seconds the right score, but after all the only impact of singular extensions >>is that they give a psychological good feeling "i'm not going to lose >>because of a cheap trick if my program messes up". Of course combinations >>can only be there and getting outsearched is only important if a program >>plays completely anti positional chess. >> >>In normal game play and in sound positions, there the value of SE and similar >>extensions gets hugely overrated i think. > > >I don't believe they _hurt_ when done right. The _last_ report by the DB >team suggested that SE was worth maybe 10-20 Elo rating points at most. If you use results of games to prove 10-20 elo improvement then you need a lot of games to prove it statistically. Even some hundreds of games are not enough and I remember cases when the ssdf list gives possible error of more than 20 inspite of hundreds of games. If you did not use games to prove that the SE helps then how did you do it? Another way that I can imagine is to use normal positions when there is no tactics but your program changes your mind to see if your program is faster or slower in finding the same positional move. Did you do it in Cray blitz and what are the results? Uri
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