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Subject: Re: obvious example

Author: Uri Blass

Date: 07:12:49 10/03/01

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On October 03, 2001 at 09:42:58, Robert Hyatt wrote:

>On October 03, 2001 at 09:12:59, Vincent Diepeveen wrote:
>
>>On October 02, 2001 at 04:54:13, Bruce Moreland wrote:
>>
>>>On October 01, 2001 at 00:36:48, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>
>>>>On September 30, 2001 at 14:47:21, Bruce Moreland wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On September 29, 2001 at 14:54:03, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On September 29, 2001 at 10:41:37, Miguel A. Ballicora wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>Super-linear speedups are "probably" impossible but so far I did not see that
>>>>>>>they are "provably" impossible. I would settle with "They are believed to be
>>>>>>>impossible".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Regards,
>>>>>>>Miguel
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>They simply _are_ impossible.  Unless you believe in perpetual
>>>>>>motion, infinite compression, a fire that will burn forever, etc.
>>>>>
>>>>>Take a human who can move a 200-pound box, but only by scraping it along the
>>>>>ground.  Compute the time it takes him to move 10 such boxes 100 yards.
>>>>>
>>>>>Assume that two humans can move a 200-pound box more easily.  Can they move a
>>>>>200-pound box more than twice as fast as one human?  Would this violate laws
>>>>>against perpetual motion?  Of course not.  It is perfectly valid to consider
>>>>>working in parallel rather than working serially.  The mechanics of the task
>>>>>might change, resulting in much increased efficiency -- they can lift the box
>>>>>off the ground.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I think that after you think about this example, you will see the flaw.
>>>>Lifting the box off the ground takes _more_ effort.  So the two people are
>>>>doing _more_ work in a given period of time than two people pushing two boxes
>>>>at the same time.  The ancient Egyptions found that dragging was better than
>>>>lifting.  :)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Two workers cooperating to perform a task, do not *have* to go less than or
>>>>>equal to the speed of two workers, each of whom does exactly half of a task that
>>>>>can be fairly divided in two.
>>>>>
>>>>>There exists the opportunity for synergy.
>>>>>
>>>>>The argument that the above violates the prohibition against perpetual motion is
>>>>>fallacious.
>>>>>
>>>>>bruce
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Not after you think about it.  If two people work and each of them moves 5
>>>>blocks, then they do no more work than the 1 person did moving 10.  But they
>>>>did it in twice the time.  If they _lift_ the block _and_ move it, they are
>>>>doing _more_ work per unit of time.  They should have moved the blocks
>>>>faster one at a time, but they were taking it easy...
>>>>
>>>> A computer can't do that.
>>>
>>>You can't possibly be arguing that there is nothing that N (N>1) people can't do
>>>in less than 1/N the time that it takes one person.
>>>
>>>I was trying to find an obvious example.  If you don't like that one, I'm sure
>>>there is another one.
>>>
>>>bruce
>>
>>Obvious example is killermoves. It improves branching factor too.
>
>
>You can't improve branching factor beyond the normal serial search branching
>factor.

It is truth only if the normal serial search is perfect and cannot be improved.
I do not believe in it.

Uri



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