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Subject: Re: TB compression idea

Author: Poschmann

Date: 00:50:56 10/28/01

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On October 28, 2001 at 02:19:31, Paul Byrne wrote:

>I've been looking at tablebases lately and was wondering if anyone
>has ever played with this idea (before I spend too much time on it!)
>
>Basically, take the normal (Nalimov or whatever) tablebases in their
>uncompressed form and divide the mate-in-x or loss-in-x values by some
>number N.  So mate-in-1 through N become (+1) mate-in-(N+1) through 2*N
>become (+2), etc.  Then compress the resulting files as usual.
>
>The idea being to reduce the number of different values to make the file
>more compressible.
>
>This would, of course, make life a little more difficult for the engine.  :)
>When the position is not yet into a tablebase, there would be little effect --
>other than any mate/loss scores being a little inaccurate.  Once the position
>on the board is actually a tablebase position, a short search would have to
>be done to determine the correct move.  For example, if the position OTB is
>scored as (+5), then one would search for the move that forces a (+4) position
>the quickest.
>
>I did a little test to see if the space savings is worthwhile...
>Using the kbbkn.nbb/nbw tablebases (something with long mates) and the
>kqnkn.nbb/nbw tablebases (mostly short mates) with various N's -- the
>numbers are the percentage of the regular _compressed_ tablebases:
>
>            N=2    N=3    N=4    N=5      N=10    N=100
>kbbkn.nbb  84.67  75.00  68.26  63.74    52.08    23.11
>kbbkn.nbw  82.96  73.21  66.98  62.13    47.80     9.10
>kqnkn.nbb  64.40  48.51  40.58  31.93    19.21     5.86
>kqnkn.nbw  63.51  46.43  37.20  28.70     6.36     2.57
>
>The last 2 columns were just out of curiousity.  :)
>
>The question is, how large can N be made while still allowing tablebase
>positions to be played out in a reasonable amount of time?  Don't know (yet).
>
>None of this would help for generating tablebases, of course.  You still need
>the normal tablebases to generate the reduced ones.  And I'd imagine most
>engine authors would prefer the full tablebases, but for the average
>player I don't know they'd notice much difference and could save a few GB
>of disk space... less stuff to distribute or download too.
>
>I suppose a lot of folks have enough disk space for 3/4/5 man tables
>nowadays, but when the 6 man tables become more complete/common, this may
>help some.
>
>-paul

If a program uses tablebaeses it do it in the following way:
1. Look into the tablebases to find the current position. For example mate in





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