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Subject: Re: example for stupid/weak Fritz5, and a personal statement

Author: Thorsten Czub

Date: 20:03:59 05/29/98

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Here is the output of CSTal (k5/100 Mhz), commercial version, in the
position AFTER Nxe4 by fritz5.
You see that cstal does not consider Nxe4 at any place.
Therefore I posted the game as an example game where Fritz5 made a
WEAK-move (from my personal point of
view).
IMO human chess players would not take on e4 since this makes it
possible for white to pin the knight.
Fritz and also other programs do this. Although they are good in finding
tactical key-moves in other positions, they
fail here.

000:02 2263n/s d1 +0.96  a8d8 b1b3 b5c4 d6d8 e8d8 d3c4 f6e4 b3b7 NULL
000:02 2518n/s d1 +1.04  b5c5 b1b3 b7b6 f3d4 NULL
000:02 2914n/s d2 +1.04  b5c5 b1b3 b7b6 f3d4 NULL
000:03 2390n/s d3 +1.04  b5c5 b1b3 b7b6 f3d4 NULL
000:06 2278n/s d4 -0.05  b5c5 b1b3 b7b6 f3d4 c5d6 c4d6 e8e7 d6f5 e7d7
f5g7 NULL
000:10 2137n/s d4 +0.79  a8d8 b1b3 b5c4 d6d8 e8d8 d3c4 d8c7 NULL
000:18 2128n/s d5 +0.75  a8d8 b1b3 b5c4 d6d8 e8d8 d3c4 d8c8 NULL
000:42 2069n/s d6 +0.75  a8d8 b1b3 b5c4 d6d8 e8d8 d3c4 d8c8 NULL
002:38 2052n/s d7 +0.75  a8d8 b1b3 b5c4 d6d8 e8d8 d3c4 d8c8 NULL
007:29 2057n/s d8 +0.89  a8d8 b1b3 b5c4 d6d8 e8d8 d3c4 d8c8 e4e5 f6d7
f3d4 d7e5 NULL

When Fritz5 played Nxe4, the output of CSTal was the following,
instantly the evaluation sees the win...

Played f6e4
000:01 2567n/s d1 -0.84  b1e1 b3c5 a2a4 b5b1 d6c5 NULL
000:02 1894n/s d2 -0.84  b1e1 b3c5 a2a4 b5b1 d6c5 NULL
000:02 2842n/s d3 !      b1e1 b3c5 NULL
000:05 2192n/s d3 +1.69  b1e1 b3c5 f3d4 c5e6 e1e4 b5b1 g1h2 b1d3 d4e6
d3d6 NULL
000:08 2049n/s d4 +1.69  b1e1 b3c5 f3d4 c5e6 e1e4 b5b1 g1h2 b1d3 d4e6
d3d6 NULL
000:10 2156n/s d5 !      b1e1 b3c5 NULL
000:23 2132n/s d5 +2.79  b1e1 b3c5 f3d4 c5e6 e1e4 b5d5 d4e6 d5d6 c4d6
e8e7 d6f5 NULL
000:46 2090n/s d6 +2.79  b1e1 b3c5 f3d4 c5e6 e1e4 b5d5 d4e6 d5d6 c4d6
e8e7 d6f5 NULL
001:03 2103n/s d7 !      b1e1 b3c5 NULL
002:14 2073n/s d7 +1.40  b1e1 b3c5 f3d4 c5e6 e1e4 b5d5 d4e6 f7e6 e4e6
e8f7 d6e7 f7g8 e7b7 a8d8 e6c6 NULL
Played b1e1

I don't think that my post of this game was cherry-picking nor do I
think it was off-topic in this newsgroup.
As a result or answer on my post Enrique and Moritz posted strange posts
with unmotivated games were cstal loses.
I don't understand this kind of "answer". My example was an effort to
answer on demands by people of this club to
show weaknesses in fritz-playing. I think this game was a weakness. I
did not CONSTRUCT or PRODUCED this
game to attack fritz or moritz or enrique. In fact this game was played
2 days ago, and since it shows a weak move,
I thought - why not posting it to express my personal and subjective
point of view.
I am afraid of the kind of reaction by enrique and moritz.
I would have wished that people replay the game and maybe try with their
own programs (ferret, crafty, mchess,
junior, chesstiger, diogenes, comet, ...). Instead enrique and moritz
felt the need to "answer" in a reflex with losses
of cstal (in a kind of automatism he instantly turned my example and
showed HIS example in the same headline,
just replaced fritz5 with cstal. I have shown that the example he chose
was not well chosen since the game he
posted was mainly determinated by the opening and the
non-trivial-temptation Bb4.) and claims of results and
calling this example worthless and cherry picking and and and.
Why do we have to do this. Moritz even tried to link my post of a weak
position with rgcc and a 1.5 years campaign
of a guy from there. He began with the statement to analyse the game,
and suddenly linked this with rgcc topics.
Isn't it possible to discuss in a normal way ? Is it legal to misuse my
example game to relate it with a guy who
called other people 1.5 years long all kind of nasty-words ?

I am shocked that moritz and later also enrique tried to suggest this.
IMO this cannot be related, and I will not accept this. not as a member.
and not as a friend.



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