Author: Paul
Date: 06:29:24 10/31/01
Go up one level in this thread
On October 31, 2001 at 03:28:12, Terry McCracken wrote: >On October 30, 2001 at 19:49:30, John Merlino wrote: > >>On October 30, 2001 at 18:24:41, Terry McCracken wrote: >> >>>[D]r5k1/ppp2r1p/3p3b/3Pn3/1n2PPp1/1P2K1P1/PBB1N2q/R2Q3R B >>> >>> >>>How do your programmes evaluate this position? >>>Do they find forced mate? >>> >>>Terry >> >>CM8000 does not find the mate in under 10 minutes on my PIII-600. It sees: >> >>1...Rxf4 2.Rxh2 Rf3+ 3.Kd4 c5+ 4.dxc6ep b5 5.Bd3 Nexc6+ 6.Kc3 Bg7+ 7.Kd2 Rxd3+ >>8.Ke1 >> >>with an eval of -1.79. Is this the right line, and CM just hasn't seen far >>enough yet? Is there really a forced mate? >> >Yes it is! Fritz with help finds a mate in 14, it was shorter in the >actual game. > >I did this quickly so a shorter mate may exist? > > >1...Rf4! 2.Rxh2..Rf3+ 3.Kd4..Bg7!!4.Rxh7..Rxh7 5.Ng1..c5+ 6.dxc ep. ..Nbc6+ >7.Kd5..Nb4+ 8.Kd4..Ned3+ 9.e5..Bxe5+ 10.Kc4..Rc8+ 11.Kb5..Rc5+ 12.Ka4..Nxb2+ >13.Kxb4..Bc3# >>jm >But mate it is! > > Terry Hi Terry, First the good news ... I like this wonderfully complex position, and already looked at it with my program a couple of times in the past. In the game, 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 d6 3. Nc3 e5 4. e4 exd4 5. Qxd4 Nc6 6. Qd2 g6 7. b3 Bg7 8. Bb2 O-O 9. Bd3 Ng4 10. Nge2 Qh4 11. Ng3 Nge5 12. O-O f5 13. f3 Bh6 14. Qd1 f4 15. Nge2 g5 16. Nd5 g4 17. g3 fxg3 18. hxg3 Qh3 19. f4 Be6 20. Bc2 Rf7 21. Kf2 Qh2 22. Ke3 Bxd5 23. cxd5 Nb4 24. Rh1 Rxf4 25. Rxh2 Rf3 26. Kd4 Bg7 27. a4 c5 28. dxc6 bxc6 29. Bd3 Nexd3 30. Kc4 d5 31. exd5 cxd5 32. Kb5 Rb8 33. Ka5 Nc6 white didn't choose the "best" defense: 27. a4? leads to a mate in 8. The bad news is, I never found a mate, and secondly, I think your line above is not totally correct ... unless I missed something (again ;), you gave: 1...Rf4! 2.Rxh2..Rf3+ 3.Kd4..Bg7!!4.Rxh7..Rxh7 5.Ng1..c5+ 6.dxc ep. ..Nbc6+ 7.Kd5..Nb4+ 8.Kd4..Ned3+ 9.e5..Bxe5+ 10.Kc4..Rc8+ 11.Kb5..Rc5+ 12.Ka4..Nxb2+ 13.Kxb4..Bc3# You probably mean 4... Kxh7, but even then 12... Nxb2+ is not possible because of a pin. Do you agree with that? Also, for ex, 8. Kd4 is not the best move (it leads to a mate in 11 ... Ned3+ e5 Bxe5+ Kc4 d5+ Kb5 a6+ Ka5 b6+ Kxb6 Rb8+ Ka5 Nc6+ Kxa6 Nb4+ Ka5 Bc7+ Ka4 Ra8+ Kb5 Ra5#), Kxd6 is tougher. Further 10... Rc8+ is not the best, d5+ is better. In short ... it really is a difficult position, it's not a mate in 13, and mine still doesn't solve it. Groetjes, Paul
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