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Subject: Re: alpha-beta is silly?

Author: blass uri

Date: 01:48:44 06/03/98

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On June 02, 1998 at 21:31:44, Robert Hyatt wrote:

>On June 02, 1998 at 18:51:26, blass uri wrote:
>
>>
>>On June 02, 1998 at 12:54:52, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>
>>>On June 02, 1998 at 11:22:58, blass uri wrote:
>>>
>>
>>>>good players do also other things
>>
>>>>2) if they do not see a forced line
>>>>(they have no time to check all the possibilities)
>>>>they can use a statistics to decide
>>>>if they see in a position  that every line they analyze
>>>>leads to their win when they play against themselves
>>>>they decide to go to the position.
>>>
>>>
>>>I don't believe human players do this.  I personally analyze concrete
>>>variations when appropriate, and rely on intuition when it is not
>>>possible
>>>due to time constraints.  Given the chance and the time, I'll analyze to
>>>reach a position I feel I can win.  Given less time I'll resort to my
>>>intuition to recognize positions I should be able to win...  and I will
>>>be wrong on occasion by doing so.  That's one of the things that
>>>separates
>>>the GM from the IM and so forth. The GM's "intuition" is better.
>>
>>I do not do this because I cannot imagine clearly the final position
>>but I believe many correspondence players do it.
>>
>>Uri
>
>I bet you do both... have you ever looked at any of the Win At Chess
>positions, or similar XXX to move and win positions?  And you can find
>forced mates?  That's all this is about.  You *know* it is forced
>because
>you looked at all the alternatives...  But in other positions, you
>search
>a move or two ahead, and say "I like this" or "I don't like this" and
>rely on intuition rather than concrete variations...

I did not talk about positions with tactical forced lines.

in correspondence game when there is a position I know I do not
understand and there is no forced line the best thing I can do is to
play against myself and if one side win to try to improve the defence
of the other side if I see that I cannot improve the defence
of the loser I decide to believe one side wins
I cannot be sure about it because I cannot check all the possibilties.

practically in 2 hours per 40 moves I cannot do it because
I cannot imagine clearly the final position that can be 30 plies
after the move I play so I rely on intuition.

of course there is a problem of time in 2 hours
per 40 moves but I believe if I could imagine clearly
the final position sometimes when it is important to know if I win or
lose some unclear position  I would think a lot about one move
and use the idea of using statistics to decide.

I believe grandmaster do it sometimes
for example in the following position I have in my book
(creative chess):
r1b2rk1/pppp1pp1/8/4pnB1/3n4/1BNP4/PPP2PP1/R3K2R
white to move
Gufled won by 14.Nd5 Nxb3 15.Nf6+ gxf6 16.Bxf6 Ng7 17.axb3 Re8
18.g4 Re6 19.g5 b6 20.Ke2 e4 21.d4 e3 22.f3 d5 23.Rh4 Ba6+ 24.c4 dxc4
25.Rah1.

how did the grandmaster find 15.Nf6+?
I believe
he understood it is an unclear position
tried to play it against himself and did not find a good defence for
black
so he decided it is good for white.


Uri



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