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Subject: Re: yace(only material) can see 0.00 (deeper blue-kasparov after Qe3)

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 07:31:45 12/03/01

Go up one level in this thread


On December 03, 2001 at 07:39:53, Uri Blass wrote:

>Here is some analysis(I also post previous analysis before Qe3 when it could not
>see the draw even after finishing iteration 18):

The question is this:  Does it see where black can _force_ the draw?  (I
seriously doubt it as it is 60 plies deep) or does it see a position where
it thinks white is worse and would therefore agree to a draw, when white is
really not worse?  IE I wouldn't trust a "material-only" score under any
circumstances, since so many scores are 0.00 when in fact one side is winning
easily.




>
>I guess that some pv extensions helped it to see the draw after Qe3
>material values that were used are pawn=0.8,bishop=3.5,rook=5,queen=10.01
>
>[D]1r6/5kp1/R1Qb1p1p/1p1PpP2/1Pp1B3/2P1q2P/6P1/5K2 w - - 0 1
>
>Analysis by Yace 0.99.56:
>
>46.Qxd6 Qxe4
>  +-  (1.60)   Depth: 1   00:00:00
>46.Qxd6 Qxe4
>  +-  (1.60)   Depth: 2   00:00:00
>46.Qxd6 Qxe4 47.Ra7+ Rb7 48.Rxb7+ Ke8
>  +-  (2.00)   Depth: 3   00:00:00
>46.Qxd6 Rg8 47.Qe6+ Kf8
>  +-  (3.50)   Depth: 3   00:00:00
>46.Qxd6 Re8 47.Bf3 Qxc3
>  +-  (2.70)   Depth: 4   00:00:00
>46.Qxd6 Re8 47.Bf3 Qc1+ 48.Kf2 Qxc3
>  +-  (2.70)   Depth: 5   00:00:00  22kN
>46.Qxd6 Re8 47.Bf3 Qc1+ 48.Kf2 Qd2+ 49.Be2 Qf4+ 50.Kg1
>  +-  (2.70)   Depth: 6   00:00:00  61kN
>46.Qxd6 Re8 47.Bf3 Qc1+ 48.Kf2 Qd2+ 49.Be2 Qf4+ 50.Ke1 Qxf5 51.Kd1
>  +-  (2.70)   Depth: 7   00:00:00  186kN
>46.Qxd6 Re8 47.Bf3 Qc1+ 48.Kf2 Qd2+ 49.Be2 Qf4+ 50.Kg1 Qe3+ 51.Kh2 Qxe2 52.Qxe5
>  +-  (2.30)   Depth: 8   00:00:00  381kN
>46.Qxd6 Re8 47.Bf3 Qc1+ 48.Kf2 Qd2+ 49.Be2 Qf4+ 50.Ke1 Qc1+ 51.Bd1 Qxc3+ 52.Kf2
>Qd4+ 53.Ke2 Qe4+ 54.Kf1
>  +-  (1.90)   Depth: 8   00:00:01  381kN
>46.Qd7+ Be7 47.d6 Qf4+ 48.Kg1 Qe3+ 49.Kh2 Qf4+ 50.g3 Qxf5 51.Bxf5 Kg8
>  +-  (1.91)   Depth: 8   00:00:01  577kN
>46.Qd7+ Kg8 47.Qxd6 Rf8 48.Qe6+ Kh7 49.Bf3 Qxc3 50.Qe7 Qd3+ 51.Kf2
>  +-  (2.70)   Depth: 8   00:00:02  577kN
>46.Qd7+ Kg8 47.Qxd6 Rf8 48.Qe6+ Kh7 49.Qe7 Rg8 50.Bf3 Qc1+ 51.Kf2 Qc2+ 52.Kg1
>Qxf5
>  +-  (2.70)   Depth: 9   00:00:03  1558kN
>46.Qd7+ Kg8 47.Qxd6 Rf8 48.Qe6+ Kh7 49.Qe7 Rg8 50.Bf3 Qc1+ 51.Kf2 Qc2+ 52.Kg1
>Qxf5 53.Kh2
>  +-  (2.70)   Depth: 10   00:00:09  4202kN
>46.Qd7+ Kg8 47.Qxd6 Rf8 48.Bf3 Qxc3 49.Qe6+ Kh7 50.Qe7 Qd3+ 51.Kf2 Kg8 52.Ra7 g6
>  +-  (2.70)   Depth: 11   00:00:27  13614kN
>46.Qd7+ Kg8 47.Qxd6 Rf8 48.Bf3 Qxc3 49.Qe6+ Kh7 50.Qe7 Qd3+ 51.Kf2 Kg8 52.Ra7
>Qd2+ 53.Kg1 Qc1+ 54.Kh2 Qf4+ 55.g3
>  +-  (2.70)   Depth: 12   00:00:58  29542kN
>46.Qd7+ Kg8 47.Qxd6 Rf8 48.Bf3 Qc1+ 49.Kf2 Qd2+ 50.Kg1 Qc1+ 51.Kh2 Qf4+ 52.g3
>Qxf3 53.Qxf6
>  +-  (2.30)   Depth: 13   00:02:22  73778kN
>46.Qd7+ Kg8 47.Qxd6 Rf8 48.Qe6+ Kh7 49.Qe7 Qxe4 50.Rxf6 Rxf6 51.Kf2
>  ±  (1.30)   Depth: 13   00:02:56  91040kN
>46.Qd7+ Kg8 47.Qxd6 Rf8 48.Qe6+ Kh7 49.Bf3 Qc1+ 50.Ke2 Qb2+ 51.Kd1 Qb1+ 52.Kd2
>Qb2+ 53.Ke1 Qxc3+ 54.Kf2 Qd2+ 55.Kg1 Qc1+ 56.Kh2 Qf4+ 57.Kh1 Qc1+ 58.Kh2 Qf4+
>59.Kh1 Qc1+ 60.Kh2
>  =  (0.00)   Depth: 13   00:03:54  120417kN
>46.Qxd6 Re8 47.h4 Qc1+ 48.Ke2 Qb2+ 49.Kd1 Qb3+ 50.Kd2 Qb2+ 51.Bc2 Rd8 52.Qxd8
>Qxb4
>  =  (0.01)   Depth: 13   00:05:56  182067kN
>46.Qxd6 Re8 47.h4 Re7 48.Bf3 Qc1+ 49.Kf2 Qd2+ 50.Kg3 Qe1+ 51.Kg4 h5+ 52.Kxh5 Qg3
>53.Be4 Qe1 54.Bc2 Qe2+ 55.g4 Qxc2
>  ±  (0.80)   Depth: 13   00:07:06  217175kN
>46.Qxd6 Re8 47.h4 Re7 48.Bf3 Qc1+ 49.Kf2 Qd2+ 50.Kg3 Qe1+ 51.Kg4 h5+ 52.Kxh5 Qg3
>53.Qe6+ Rxe6 54.dxe6+ Kf8 55.Ra8+ Ke7 56.Ra7+ Ke8 57.Bc6+ Kf8 58.e7+ Kg8 59.e8Q+
>Kh7
>  ±  (1.20)   Depth: 14   00:16:57  511832kN
>46.Qxd6 Re8 47.h4 h5 48.Bf3 Qc1+ 49.Kf2 Qd2+ 50.Be2 Qf4+ 51.Ke1 Qc1+ 52.Bd1
>Qxc3+ 53.Kf1 Qc1 54.Ra7+
>  ±  (1.20)   Depth: 14   00:18:50  567641kN
>46.Qxd6 Re8 47.h4 h5 48.Bf3 Qc1+ 49.Kf2 Qd2+ 50.Be2 Qf4+ 51.Ke1 Qc1+ 52.Bd1
>Qxc3+ 53.Kf1 Qc1 54.Ra7+ Kg8 55.Ke2 Qb2+ 56.Ke3 Qc1+ 57.Kf3 Qxd1+ 58.Kg3
>  ±  (0.80)   Depth: 15   00:38:29  1120485kN
>46.Qxd6 Re8 47.h4 h5 48.Bf3 Qc1+ 49.Kf2 Qd2+ 50.Be2 Qf4+ 51.Ke1 Qc1+ 52.Bd1
>Qxc3+ 53.Kf1 Qc1 54.Ra7+ Kg8 55.Ke2 Qb2+ 56.Ke1 Qc3+ 57.Kf1 Qc1 58.Ke2 Qb2+
>59.Ke1 Qc3+ 60.Kf1 Qc1
>  =  (0.00)   Depth: 15   00:48:38  1415959kN
>
>(Blass, Tel-aviv 03.12.2001)
>
>1r6/5kp1/RqQb1p1p/1p1PpP2/1Pp1B3/2P4P/6P1/5K2 b - - 0 1
>
>Analysis by Yace 0.99.56:
>
>45...Qxa6 46.Qxa6
>  +-  (5.01)   Depth: 1   00:00:00
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6
>  =  (0.00)   Depth: 1   00:00:00
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6
>  =  (0.00)   Depth: 2   00:00:00
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Be7 47.c7 Re8
>  =  (0.00)   Depth: 3   00:00:00
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Be7 47.c7 Re8 48.Kf2
>  =  (0.00)   Depth: 4   00:00:00
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Be7 47.c7 Rc8 48.Rc6 Kf8
>  =  (0.00)   Depth: 5   00:00:00  4kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Be7 47.c7 Rc8 48.Rc6 Kf8 49.Kf2
>  =  (0.00)   Depth: 6   00:00:00  13kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Kf2 Bc7 48.Bd5 Bd8 49.Kg1
>  =  (0.00)   Depth: 7   00:00:00  37kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Kf2 Bc7 48.Bd5 Bd8 49.Kg1 Rc8
>  =  (0.00)   Depth: 8   00:00:00  76kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Kf2 Bc7 48.Bd5 Bd8 49.Kg1 Rc8 50.Kh2
>  =  (0.00)   Depth: 9   00:00:00  170kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Kf2 Bc7 48.Bd5 Bd8 49.Kg1 Rc8 50.Kh2 Rb8
>  =  (0.00)   Depth: 10   00:00:00  396kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Ra7 Rc8 48.Bd5 Be7 49.Rb7 Bxb4 50.cxb4 Rd8 51.c7 c3
>  ²  (0.40)   Depth: 11   00:00:02  1168kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Ra7 Rc8 48.Bd5 Bc7 49.Rb7 Bd8 50.Rxb5 Ke8 51.Bxc4
>  ±  (0.80)   Depth: 11   00:00:02  1168kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Ra7 Rc8 48.Bd5 h5 49.Rb7 Ke8 50.Be6 Rc7 51.Bd7+ Ke7
>52.Rxb5
>  ±  (0.80)   Depth: 12   00:00:07  3666kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Ra7 Rc8 48.Bd5 Rc7 49.Ra8+ Ke7 50.Ra5 Kf8 51.Rxb5 Rc8
>52.Rb6 Bc7
>  ±  (0.80)   Depth: 13   00:00:15  7435kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Ra7 Rc8 48.Bd5 Rc7 49.Ra8+ Ke7 50.Ra5 Kf8 51.Rxb5 Rc8
>52.Rb6 Bc7 53.Rb5
>  ±  (0.80)   Depth: 14   00:00:57  29255kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Ra7 Rc8 48.Bd5 Rc7 49.Ra8+ Ke7 50.Rg8 g5 51.fxg6 Bxb4
>52.cxb4 Kd6 53.g7 c3 54.Rd8+ Ke7
>  ±  (1.20)   Depth: 15   00:01:52  58976kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Ra7 Rc8 48.Bd5 Rc7 49.Ra8+ Ke7 50.Rg8 e4 51.Rxg7+ Kf8
>52.Rg8+ Ke7 53.Bxe4 Be5 54.Rh8 Bxc3
>  +-  (1.60)   Depth: 15   00:02:08  68880kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Ra7 Rc8 48.Bd5 Rc7 49.Ra8+ Ke7 50.Rg8 e4 51.Rxg7+ Kf8
>52.Rg8+ Ke7 53.Bxe4 Be5 54.Rb8 Bxc3
>
>55.Rxb5
>  +-  (1.60)   Depth: 16   00:05:01  157970kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Ra7 Rc8 48.Bd5 Rc7 49.Ra8+ Ke7 50.Rg8 e4 51.Rxg7+ Kf8
>52.Rg8+ Ke7 53.Bxe4 Be5
>  +-  (1.60)   Depth: 17   00:09:56  313008kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Ra7 Rc8 48.Bd5 Rc7 49.Ra8+ Ke7
>  +-  (1.60)   Depth: 18   02:21:38  4134460kN
>45...Qxc6 46.dxc6 Kf8 47.Ra7 Rc8 48.Bd5 Rc7 49.Ra8+ Ke7 50.Ra5 Kf8
>  +-  (1.60)   Depth: 19   03:07:12  1233467kN
>
>(Blass, Tel-aviv 03.12.2001)
>
>Uri



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