Author: Dann Corbit
Date: 16:33:51 12/17/01
Go up one level in this thread
On December 17, 2001 at 18:08:28, Steffen Jakob wrote:
>In a game between Hossa and IM Lehner the following position was on the board:
>
>[D]8/8/4B3/8/p7/k1p5/P1K5/8 w - - 0 68
>
>Which engines see that this is a draw (with/without tablebases)?
>
>Here is the complete game score:
>
>[Event "ICC 3 0"]
>[Site "Internet Chess Club"]
>[Date "2001.12.17"]
>[Round "-"]
>[White "Hossa"]
>[Black "Hirug"]
>[Result "1/2-1/2"]
>[ICCResult "Game drawn by mutual agreement"]
>[WhiteElo "2741"]
>[BlackElo "2558"]
>[Opening "Old Indian defense"]
>[ECO "A42"]
>[NIC "OI.07"]
>[Time "17:46:11"]
>[TimeControl "180+0"]
>
>1. d4 d6 2. c4 Nd7 3. e4 e5 4. Nf3 Ngf6 5. Bd3 Be7 6. O-O O-O 7. Nc3 c6 8.
>d5 cxd5 9. exd5 Nc5 10. Bc2 a5 11. Be3 b6 12. Ng5 h6 13. Nge4 Nfxe4 14. Nxe4
>f5 15. Nxc5 bxc5 16. Qf3 e4 17. Qh5 Bf6 18. Rab1 Qe8 19. Qe2 Be5 20. Bd2 Bd7
>21. Bc3 Bxc3 22. bxc3 Rb8 23. Rxb8 Qxb8 24. Rb1 Qc7 25. f3 exf3 26. Qxf3 g6
>27. Qe3 Kg7 28. Qe7+ Rf7 29. Qh4 g5 30. Qh5 Qd8 31. Rf1 Qf6 32. Qf3 f4 33.
>h3 Re7 34. h4 Re3 35. hxg5 hxg5 36. Qh5 Bf5 37. Ba4 Bg6 38. Qg4 Bf5 39. Qh5
>Rxc3 40. Bb5 Bg6 41. Qg4 Re3 42. Bc6 Bf5 43. Qh5 Qe7 44. Rf2 Bg6 45. Qg4
>Re1+ 46. Kh2 Qe5 47. Qd7+ Kh6 48. Qh3+ Bh5 49. Qe6+ Qxe6 50. dxe6 Rxe6 51.
>Rd2 Kg7 52. Rd5 Kf6 53. Rd2 Bg4 54. Bd7 Re2 55. Rxd6+ Ke7 56. Bxg4 Rxg2+ 57.
>Kxg2 Kxd6 58. Kh3 Ke5 59. Bd1 Kd4 60. Kg4 Kxc4 61. Kxg5 Kb4 62. Kxf4 Ka3 63.
>Bb3 a4 64. Be6 Kb4 65. Ke3 c4 66. Kd2 c3+ 67. Kc2 Ka3 68. Bf7 Kb4 69. Bg8
>Ka3 70. Be6 Kb4 71. Bf7 Ka3 72. Kc1 Kb4 73. Bd5 Ka3 74. Kb1 Kb4 75. Kc2 Ka3
>76. Kc1 Kb4 77. Kb1 Ka3 78. Be6 Kb4 79. Kc1 Ka3 80. Bc4 Kb4 81. Bd3 Ka3 82.
>Bb1 Kb4 83. Be4 Ka3 84. Kb1 Kb4 85. Bf5 Ka3 86. Bh7 Kb4 87. Bc2 Ka3 88. Bd1
>Kb4 89. Be2 Ka3 90. Bd3 Kb4 91. Ka1 Ka3 92. Bg6 {Game drawn by mutual
>agreement} 1/2-1/2
Crafty's score looks drawish:
60-> 1:18 0.46 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Bd5 Kb4 4. Bf7 Ka3 5.
Kb1 Kb4 6. Be6 Ka3 7. Bc4 Kb4 8. Bf7
Ka3 9. Be6 Kb4 10. Bg8 Ka3 11. Kc2
Kb4 12. Bd5 Ka3 13. Kb1 Kb4 14. Bc6
Ka3 15. Be4 Kb4 16. Bd3 Ka3 17. Bg6
Kb4 18. Bc2 Ka3 19. Bh7 Kb4 20. Bf5
Ka3 21. Bc2 Kb4 22. Bh7 Ka3 23. Bf5
Kb4 24. Bg6 Kc4 25. Be8 Kb4 26. Kc1
Ka3 27. Bf7 Kb4 28. Be6 Ka3 29. Bc4
Kb4 30. Bf7 Ka3 31. Kc2 Kb4
Yace thinks there is a big advantage:
127377248 9:28.2 2.22 60t 1.Bf7 Kb4 2.Bg8 Ka3 3.Be6 Kb4 4.Bf5 Ka3 5.Kb1
Kb4H 6.Kc1H Ka3H 7.Bb1H Kb4H 8.Bc2H Ka3H 9.Kb1H
Kb4H 10.Kc1H Ka3H 11.Kb1H Kb4H 12.Kc1HR {270}
Beowulf sees 1 and 1/3 pawn advantage:
23 133 17196 5859209 e6g8 a3b4 g8f7 b4a3 f7e6 a3b4 e6g8 b4a3 g8e6
&rep.
Leila:
Score: 233 Time: 60 Nodes: 11713502 nps: 195172 PV: Be6f7 Ka3b4
Bf7g8 Kb4a3 Bg8e6 Ka3b4 Be6f7 Kb4a3 Bf7g8 Ka3b4 Bg8d5 Kb4c5 Bd5a8 Kc5b4 Ba8e4
Kb4a3 Be4d5 Ka3b4 Kc2d3 Kb4a3 Kd3xc3
** OK ** Solving Time: 0.35 Solving Nodes: 28532 Score:
+2.33
Amy thinks she found something good:
39 2:23 +++ 1. Bd5
39 2:44 +3.033 1. Bd5 Kb4 2. Kd3 Kc5 3. Be4 Kb4 4. a3+ Kb3 5. Bg2 c2 6.
Ke4 c1=Q 7. Kd5
ExChess has an interesting roller-coaster:
6. --
6. 1.16 0 144476 1. Bd5 Kb4 2. Kd3 Ka3 3. Bc4 Kb2
6. 1.18 0 148472 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Kd3 Ka3 3. Bd5 Kb4
6. 1.18 0 152183 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Kd3 Ka3 3. Bd5 Kb4
7. 1.19 0 152467 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Kd3 Ka3 3. Bd5 Kb4 4. Ke4
7. 1.19 0 157677 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Kd3 Ka3 3. Bd5 Kb4 4. Ke4
8. ++ 0 159591 1. Bf7
8. 3.04 0 162279 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Be6 Ka3 3. Bg8 Kb4 4. Kd3 Kc5 5. Kxc3
8. 3.04 0 169995 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Be6 Ka3 3. Bg8 Kb4 4. Kd3 Kc5 5. Kxc3
9. 3.10 0 173796 1. Bg8 Kb4 2. Be6 Ka3 3. Bf7 Kb4 4. Kd3 Kc5 5. Kxc3
9. 3.10 0 174574 1. Bg8 Kb4 2. Be6 Ka3 3. Bf7 Kb4 4. Kd3 Kc5 5. Kxc3
10. --
10. 1.18 0 240399 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bf7
10. 1.18 0 262800 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bf7
11. 1.18 0 273229 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bf7
11. 1.18 0 286410 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bf7
12. 1.18 0 300989 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bf7
12. 1.18 0 314684 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bf7
13. 1.18 0 334871 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bf7
13. 1.18 0 361565 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bf7
14. 1.18 0 384451 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bf7
14. 1.18 0 417161 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bf7
15. 1.18 1 445689 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bf7
15. 1.18 1 491091 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bf7
16. ++ 1 497109 1. Bf7
16. --
16. 3.04 3 1308234 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bf7 Ka3 5. Be6
Kb4 6. Kc2 Ka3 7. Bg8 Kb4 8. Kd3 Kc5 9. Kxc3
16. 3.04 3 1339500 1. Bf7 Kb4 2. Bg8 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bf7 Ka3 5. Be6
Kb4 6. Kc2 Ka3 7. Bg8 Kb4 8. Kd3 Kc5 9. Kxc3
17. 3.12 6 2935532 1. Bg8 Kb4 2. Bf7 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bg8 Ka3 5. Be6
Kb4 6. Bf7 Ka3 7. Kc2 Kb4 8. Be6 Kc5 9. Kxc3
17. 3.12 6 2980105 1. Bg8 Kb4 2. Bf7 Ka3 3. Kc1 Kb4 4. Bg8 Ka3 5. Be6
Kb4 6. Bf7 Ka3 7. Kc2 Kb4 8. Be6 Kc5 9. Kxc3
18. --
18. 1.18 43 26348196 1. Bg8 Kb4 2. Kc1 Ka3 3. Bd5 Kb4 4. Bf7 Ka3 5. Kc2
Kb4 6. Bg8 Ka3 7. Be6 Kb4 8. Kd3 Ka3 9. Bd5 Kb4
18. 1.18 46 27620891 1. Bg8 Kb4 2. Kc1 Ka3 3. Bd5 Kb4 4. Bf7 Ka3 5. Kc2
Kb4 6. Bg8 Ka3 7. Be6 Kb4 8. Kd3 Ka3 9. Bd5 Kb4
19. ++ 49 28616249 1. Bg8
Pepito sees a two pawn advantage:
28 221 10624 82103912 Be6-c4 Ka3-b4 Bc4-g8 Kb4-a3 Bg8-e6 Ka3-b4 Be6-f7 Kb4-a3
Kc2-b1 Ka3-b4 Kb1-c1 Kb4-a3 Kc1-c2 Ka3-b4 Bf7-g6 Kb4-a3 Kc2-b1 Ka3-b4 Bg6-c2
Kb4-a3 Bc2-h7 Ka3-b4 Bh7-g6 Kb4-c4 Kb1-c2 Kc4-b4 Bg6-d3 a3
Quark also goes roller-coaster...
20 330 3870 24226191 e6d5 a3b4 d5f7 b4a3 c2b1 a3b4 f7g8 b4a3 g8h7 a3b4
b1c1 b4a3 h7g8 a3b4 c1c2 b4a3 g8f7 a3b4
c2d3 b4c5
21 360 3922 24502143 e6d5!
21 330 4698 29105179 e6d5 a3b4 d5f7 b4a3 c2b1 a3b4 f7g8 b4a3 g8h7 a3b4
b1c1 b4a3 h7g8 a3b4 c1c2 b4a3 g8e6 a3b4
e6f5 b4a3 c2c3
21 330 5473 33753786 e6d5 a3b4 d5f7 b4a3 c2b1 a3b4 f7g8 b4a3 g8h7 a3b4
b1c1 b4a3 h7g8 a3b4 c1c2 b4a3 g8e6 a3b4
e6f5 b4a3 c2c3
Phalanx says between 2 & 3 pawns:
20 265 15228 33857270 Kc2-c1 Ka3-b4 Be6-f5 Kb4-a3 Bf5-b1 Ka3-b4
Kc1-d1 Kb4-c4 Kd1-e2 Kc4-b4 Ke2-d3 Kb4-a3
Kd3-c2 Ka3-b4
20 266 16255 35991072 Be6-d5 Ka3-b4 Bd5-b3 Pa4xb3
Pharaon sees stalemate instantly:
setboard 8/8/4B3/8/p7/k1p5/P1K5/8 w - -
Move #1, White to move
8 - - - -
7 - - - -
6 - - B - -
5 - - - -
4 p - - - -
3 k p - -
2 P - K - - -
1 - - - -
a b c d e f g h
8/8/4B3/8/p7/k1p5/P1K5/8 w - -
Pharaon 2.50 has used less time because it seems to be an 'easy' move
time:0.06s, nodes:52, nps:966, evals:33 (63.5%)
HT Hit:0.0% (0/47), HT Refut:0.0%, HP Hit:87.3%, TB: 9
1. ... c2c3
Move #1, Black to move
8 - - - -
7 - - - -
6 - - B - -
5 - - - -
4 p - - - -
3 k K - -
2 P - - - -
1 - - - -
a b c d e f g h
8/8/4B3/8/p7/k1K5/P7/8 b - -
1/2-1/2 {Stalemate}
The Crazy Bishop had a 3 pawn advantage scored for quite a while, but now is
starting to get the idea.
15. 332 4514 38880864 Bc4 Kb4 Bd5 Ka3 Bf7 Kb4 Bg8 Ka3 Bd5
16. 238 23331 197315412 Bc4 Kb4 Bd5 Ka3 Bf7 Kb4 Bg8 Ka3 Bd5
In summary, of the free engines tested:
Pharaon instantly sees the draw.
Crafty scores it at drawish level immediately and hold the drawish score for at
least 60 plies.
No other program (among those that I tested) seems to understand the position
[unless, of course, they are trying to bluff a win by error of the opponent]
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