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Subject: Re: Nolot 6 TEST Results...

Author: Uri Blass

Date: 14:18:19 03/14/02

Go up one level in this thread


On March 14, 2002 at 16:58:50, Slater Wold wrote:

>On March 14, 2002 at 16:35:43, Rex wrote:
>
>>How long does it take your program to show a positive eval for black from this
>>position?    black to move.
>>looking for this line:   16...0-0  17.Ke1 Qh4+  18.g3 Qf6  19.Bf4 Bf5
>>or  19...g5  or  19...d3
>>eval should go positive sometime after finding 19.Bf4
>>this position is six moves into the Nolot 6 test.
>> [D] 1Qbqk2r/1p3ppp/8/1p1Pp3/1PPpP1n1/P7/4K1PP/R1B2B1R b kq - 10 1
>>
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>>here is the complete game of the Nolot 6 test.
>>The Nolot 6 test starts with 13...axb5. but for now will you start with the
>>above position? please post your program with your results. i will make a note
>>of all results, and then i will repost later backing up one black move.
>>
>>[Date "1988"]
>>[White "Malaniuk, V"]
>>[Black "Ivanchuk, V"]
>>[Result "0-1"]
>>[ECO "E20"]
>>
>>1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 e6 3. Nc3 Bb4 4. f3 d5 5. a3
>>Be7 6. e4 dxe4 7. fxe4 e5 8. d5 Ng4 9. Nf3
>>Bc5 10. b4 Bf2+ 11. Ke2 c5 12. Nb5 a6 13. Qa4
>>axb5 14. Qxa8 Bd4 15. Nxd4 cxd4 16. Qxb8 O-O 17. Ke1
>>Qh4+ 18. g3 Qf6 19. Bf4 g5 20. c5 exf4 21. Qd6
>>Qg7 22. Bd3 Ne5 23. Kd2 f3 24. Qe7 g4 25. Bxb5
>>Ng6 26. Qg5 h6 27. Qh5 d3 28. Bxd3 Re8 29. h3
>>Re5 30. hxg4 Rxh5 31. gxh5 Ne5 32. Rae1 Qg5+ 33. Kc2
>>f2 34. Rd1 Qe3  0-1
>>
>>kburcham
>>--------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>After 14hr of Deep Analysis with Crafty (Heavily Modified) here are my results.
>>
>>
>>00:00:01.3	5.07	6	142380	O-O Ke1 f5 exf5 bxc4 d6
>>00:00:01.3	5.07	6	178385	O-O Ke1 f5 exf5 bxc4 d6
>>00:00:01.3	4.77	7	306130	O-O c5 d3+ Ke1 Qh4+ g3 Qf6 Kd2 Bf5
>>00:00:02.4	4.13	7	592998	bxc4 Ke1 d3 d6 O-O Bd2 Qh4+ g3
>>00:00:02.4	4.13	7	654737	bxc4 Ke1 d3 d6 O-O Bd2 Qh4+ g3
>>00:00:02.4	4.92	8	849662	bxc4 Ke1 d3 Bg5 f6 Bd2 O-O d6
>>00:00:04.7	4.16	8	1926252	O-O c5 Qf6 Qd6 Qf2+ Kd3 f5 Bd2 fxe4+
>>00:00:04.7	4.16	8	2218225	O-O c5 Qf6 Qd6 Qf2+ Kd3 f5 Bd2 fxe4+
>>00:00:06.9	3.76	9	3010175	O-O
>>00:00:07.2	3.52	9	4383907	O-O Ke1 Qh4+ g3 Qf6 Ra2 bxc4 d6 c3 Bd3
>>00:00:09.4	3.52	9	5993747	O-O Ke1 Qh4+ g3 Qf6 Ra2 bxc4 d6 c3 Bd3
>>00:00:17.6	3.12	10	11383111	O-O
>>00:00:25.7	3.09	10	17005395	O-O Ke1 Qh4+ g3 Qf6 Ra2 bxc4 d6 c3 Bd3 Bd7 Qxb7 Qxd6
>>00:00:30.4	3.09	10	20929131	O-O Ke1 Qh4+ g3 Qf6 Ra2 bxc4 d6 c3 Bd3 Bd7 Qxb7 Qxd6
>>00:00:44.4	3.06	11	30700183	O-O Ke1 bxc4 Bxc4 Qb6 Be2 Bd7 Bxg4 Rxb8 Bxd7 Qg6 Bf5
>>Qxg2
>>00:01:01.8	3.06	11	44622256	O-O Ke1 bxc4 Bxc4 Qb6 Be2 Bd7 Bxg4 Rxb8 Bxd7 Qg6 Bf5
>>Qxg2
>>00:01:36.9	2.66	12	69027127	O-O
>>00:02:42.5	2.42	12	118334198	O-O Ke1 bxc4 Ra2 c3 Be2 f5 Bxg4 Qh4+ Rf2 Qxg4 Qxe5
>>Qxe4+ Re2
>>00:03:24.4	2.42	12	152803922	O-O Ke1 bxc4 Ra2 c3 Be2 f5 Bxg4 Qh4+ Rf2 Qxg4 Qxe5
>>Qxe4+ Re2
>>00:05:07.3	2.45	13	226676167	O-O Ke1 bxc4 Ra2 d3 d6 f5 exf5 Qf6 Qc7 Bxf5 Kd2 b5
>>00:08:23.5	2.45	13	392833823	O-O Ke1 bxc4 Ra2 d3 d6 f5 exf5 Qf6 Qc7 Bxf5 Kd2 b5
>>00:16:30.4	2.05	14	757973363	O-O
>>00:37:16.7	1.40	14	1729099050	O-O Ke1 Qh4+ g3 Qf6 Bf4 d3 Ra2 exf4 Qxf4 bxc4 h3
>>Qc3+ Qd2 Qe5 Bxd3 cxd3 hxg4 Qxe4+
>>00:43:53.7	1.40	14	2083604372	O-O Ke1 Qh4+ g3 Qf6 Bf4 d3 Ra2 exf4 Qxf4 bxc4 h3
>>Qc3+ Qd2 Qe5 Bxd3 cxd3 hxg4 Qxe4+
>>01:10:43.3	1.09	15	-1002787038	O-O Ke1 Qh4+ g3 Qf6 Bf4 d3 Ra2 exf4 Qxf4 bxc4 h3
>>Qxf4 gxf4 Nf6 Bg2 c3
>>01:32:50.0	1.09	15	183549695	O-O Ke1 Qh4+ g3 Qf6 Bf4 d3 Ra2 exf4 Qxf4 bxc4 h3
>>Qxf4 gxf4 Nf6 Bg2 c3
>>03:00:16.3	0.69	16	-150968701	O-O
>>05:30:14.1	0.36	16	-1706328130	O-O Ke1 Qh4+ g3 Qf6 Bf4 d3 Ra2 Bf5 Qc7 Bxe4 Rg1
>>06:35:28.9	0.36	16	1782816195	O-O Ke1 Qh4+ g3 Qf6 Bf4 d3 Ra2 Bf5 Qc7 Bxe4 Rg1
>>14:04:38.3	0.31	17	1518353005	O-O Ra2 Qh4 g3 Qf6 Bf4 Bf5 Qxb7 Bxe4 Qd7 d3+ Kd2
>>Bxh1 Qxg4 bxc4 Qg5 exf4 Qxf6 gxf6
>>
>>
>>As you can see O-O is found at once!!  Interesting note is Ra2 at depth 17...
>>BUT notice variation are pretty much the same after that.  b3 to Bf5 because of
>>Ra2.. Score keeps falling towards black..
>
>20+ moves after the initial move, and computers still cannot see this positions
>is winning.

If computers cannot see than my first suspect is that it is not winning.
I am not sure if the suspect is correct but I do not like criticizing the
computers without analyzing the line that they suggest(Ra2 after 0-0 and not Ke1
based on the post because Crafty changed it's main line from 0-0 Ke1 to 0-0
Ra2).

Uri



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