Author: martin fierz
Date: 18:36:55 03/29/02
Go up one level in this thread
On March 29, 2002 at 18:27:14, Christophe Theron wrote: >On March 29, 2002 at 11:29:28, Ed Schröder wrote: > >>On March 29, 2002 at 10:12:41, Christophe Theron wrote: >> >>>On March 28, 2002 at 20:32:40, Tom Kerrigan wrote: >>> >>>>Some things come to mind, thinking a little more about this. >>>> >>>>First is electromigration. When current goes through circuits, the paths are >>>>eroded by miniscule amounts. This basically only matters within dense chips like >>>>microprocessors, where the connections are only a few hundred molecules wide. >>>>The point is that these chips wear out when you use them, but they're still >>>>designed/manufactured for 10+ years of continuous use, so it doesn't really >>>>matter. The problem is when you start overclocking and upping the current >>>>through the chips--some people claim that with high current, CPUs can be >>>>destroyed because of electromigration within 2 years. Again, not a problem if >>>>you don't overclock. >>>> >>>>The only other parts of a computer that wear out are the capacitors and the >>>>moving parts, i.e., the fans and hard drive. Old capacitors leak, but I don't >>>>know how usage patterns affect this leakage. I also don't know if fans wear out >>>>faster if they're left on or if they're cycled on and off. I know that hard >>>>drives used to wear when they were turned on and off, but now that we have >>>>autoparking heads and so forth, I don't think that's an issue. Laptop >>>>power-saving software is constantly turning hard drives on and off, and I >>>>haven't heard complains frop laptop users about hard drive lifespans. >>>> >>>>Really, I don't think it matters. I know people who leave their computers on all >>>>day and I know other people who turn theirs on and off many times per day, and >>>>the compuers all last a darn long time. >>> >>> >>> >>>Where I live leaving computers on matters a lot, but for a different reason. >>> >>>Here in Guadeloupe, we are living under a tropical climate. >>> >>>The climate is very humid, and when I leave a computer off for say one month, >>>this computer stays at "room temperature" and is subject to water condensation. >>> >>>Water molecules contained in the air condense when they touch the metallic parts >>>of the computer, everywhere including on printed circuits. This leads to slow >>>corrosion of the unprotected metallic parts. >>> >>>Older computers were better protected against this problem because they were >>>built with higher standards and also because the printed circuits paths were >>>larger (it took longer for corrosion to eat them completely). >>> >>>Current motherboards for example are really poorly protected. You can find >>>unprotected copper paths everywhere on the surface of a modern motherboard. >>>These unprotected areas are time bombs where I live: sooner or later the climate >>>will eat them up. >>> >>>By leaving my computers on all the time I let them stay at a higher temperature. >>>Condensation cannot happen when the computer is warmer than "room temperature", >>>and this provides some protection against corrosion. >>> >>>By experience, every time I leave a computer off for a long period of time, I >>>have 50% chances to be able to get it working again. >>> >>>Half of the times it simply won't boot. Generally I have to replace the >>>motherboard of the video card to get it working again. >>> >>> >>>As a side note I would say that current hardware is real shit. I have several >>>computers built around 1990. They still work fine, and they have been subject to >>>corrosion for 8 years now. >>> >>>Modern hardware cannot resist more than a few months here. >>> >>> >>> >>> Christophe >> >> >>I wonder if "salt" is also an issue. I heard when you live close to the sea your >>car is going to rust much earlier. I am not sure that still holds for nowadays >>cars but perhaps the computer industry just doesn't care for people living near >>the sea. >> >>Ed > > > >Yes you are absolutely right. Remember the two P200 motherboards you sent me 3 >years ago? One of them was mounted inside a normal PC box. The other one was >mounted without box. Just a power supply connected to the motherboard and a >floppy disk. Both were running 24/7. > >Because it was not protected, the second one died in a few month. The second one >still works. At that time I had not understood the problem with the climate and >the salted air. > >Indeed, I have actually _tasted_ the surface of the motherboard. The taste was >salty. And salt is extremely corrosive for metal parts. > >Now that I have moved my office far from the sea, I hope to have at least >partially solved this problem. > > > > Christophe hi christophe! i live at the sea too for the first time in my life, in honolulu, and my bike which is quite new is already rusting. i also think it's the salt in the air. i'm a physicist and did a lot of research on aerosols, so i can tell you the following: 1) aerosols (like salt particles generated by waves) can travel large distances and 2) there are good filters to remove them. you have to look for a quality filter which removes even very small particles (100nanometer), put it in your aircondish, that could help. better than buying new computers all the time! aloha martin
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