Author: Uri Blass
Date: 01:06:37 04/07/02
Go up one level in this thread
On April 07, 2002 at 00:27:46, pavel wrote:
>>Nice to see that an older version of my program is only 2 steps from the best.
>>I already posted that game in the past but here it is again.
>>
>>Movei used only a piece square table evaluation and did not use pondering,book
>>or hash tables.
>>
>>Nejmet blundered by 15...Nxc2 and lost the game
>>How much time does Nejmet need to avoid Nxc2?
>>
>>Note that it was not a trap that my program planned and Movei was also surprised
>>to find that it is winning after 15...Nxc2.
>>
>>
>>The game was with pondering on.
>>
>>[Event "Test4"]
>>[Site "DUAL-P3-1266"]
>>[Date "2002.03.18"]
>>[Round "12"]
>>[Number "34"]
>>[White "Movei005kk"]
>>[Black "Nejmet305"]
>>[Result "1-0"]
>>[TimeControl "40/1200"]
>>
>>1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 e6 3. Nc3 a6 4. Be2 Nc6 5. d4 cxd4 6. Nxd4 Nge7 7. Be3 Nxd4
>>8. Qxd4 Nc6 9. Qb6 Qf6 10. O-O Bb4 11. Bd2 Qe5 12. Rae1 Bc5 13. Qb3 Bd6 14.
>>g3 Nd4 15. Qc4 Nxc2 16. Bf4 Qc5 17. Bxd6 Qxd6 18. Rd1 Qe7 19. a3 Nxa3 20.
>>bxa3 Qxa3 21. e5 Qa5 22. Qd4 O-O 23. Ne4 Qd8 24. Nd6 b6 25. Nxc8 Rxc8 26.
>>Bxa6 Rc5 27. Qd6 Qa8 28. Bd3 Qb8 29. f4 Qxd6 30. exd6 f5 31. Kf2 Rfc8 32.
>>Ba6 Rc2+ 33. Kg1 Ra8 34. Bd3 Rc5 35. Be2 Ra2 36. Kf2 Rcc2 37. Rfe1 Kf7 38.
>>Rd3 Rab2 39. h4 b5 40. Ke3 b4 41. h5 Rc4 42. Bf3 Ra2 43. g4 fxg4 44. Bxg4
>>Kf6 45. Bf3 Ra5 46. Rf1 Kf5 47. Rg1 Kf6 48. Bg4 Ra2 49. Rgd1 Ra6 50. Bf3
>>Kf5 51. Rg1 Kf6 52. Be4 Ra5 53. Rh1 h6 54. Rh2 Rac5 55. Rh4 Rc1 56. Rb3
>>R1c3+ 57. Rxc3 bxc3 58. Rh2 e5 59. f5 Rc4 60. Rg2 Rd4 61. Rg6+ Kf7 62. Bc2
>>Rf4 63. Be4 Rf1 64. Kd3 Rf4 65. f6 Rxf6 66. Bd5+ Kf8 67. Rxf6+ gxf6 68.
>>Kxc3 f5 69. Bc4 Ke8 70. Bb5 f4 71. Kd3 f3 72. Bc4 Kf8 73. Ke3
>>{Black resign} 1-0
>>
>>Uri
>
>the next game --->
>
>[Event "PAVS, 40'/40+40'/40+40'"]
>[Site "PAVS"]
>[Date "2002.04.06"]
>[Round "2"]
>[White "Fritz 7"]
>[Black "Nejmet_3.05"]
>[Result "1-0"]
>[ECO "B46"]
>[WhiteElo "2500"]
>[BlackElo "2500"]
>[PlyCount "55"]
>
>{W=11.3 ply; 343kN/s
>B=11.6 ply; 182kN/s
>} 1. Nf3 {Black last book move 0}
>1... c5 {0.01/0 0} 2. e4 {0} 2... e6 {0.01/0 0} 3. d4 {0} 3... cxd4 {0.01/0 0}
>4. Nxd4 {0} 4... a6 {0.01/0 0} 5. Nc3 {0} 5... Nc6 {0.01/0 0} 6. Nxc6 {0} 6...
>bxc6 {0.01/0 0} 7. Bd3 {0} 7... d6 {0.01/0 0} 8. O-O {0} 8... Nf6 {0.01/0 0} 9.
>f4 {0} 9... Qc7 {0.01/0 0} 10. Qe2 {0} 10... Be7 {
>White last book move 0.30/11 61} 11. e5 {0.25/13 73} 11... dxe5 {0.04/11 62}
>12. fxe5 {0.47/5 50} 12... Nd7 {0.38/11 100} 13. Bf4 {(Kh1) 0.31/6 117} 13...
>Qb6+ {0.00/11 89} 14. Kh1 {0.19/8 58} 14... Qxb2 {0.14/11 61} 15. Bd2 {
>0.28/12 61} 15... Qb8 {0.09/10 62} 16. Rae1 {0.56/12 72} 16... Bb7 {
>(Qc7) 0.40/10 76} 17. Ne4 {(Qh5) 0.84/13 250} 17... Nxe5 {(c5) -0.49/11 102}
>18. Bf4 {1.41/12 39} 18... f6 {1.40/11 171} 19. Qh5+ {(Ng5) 1.56/11 33} 19...
>g6 {1.47/12 107} 20. Qh6 {1.88/12 34} 20... Bc8 {2.16/11 106} 21. Qg7 {
>2.19/11 18} 21... Rf8 {2.62/11 55} 22. Qxh7 {(Bxe5) 2.28/11 33} 22... f5 {
>(Ra7) 2.86/11 81} 23. Ng5 {(Qg7) 3.84/12 38} 23... Bd6 {4.72/12 95} 24. Bxe5 {
>4.31/11 28} 24... Bxe5 {6.30/11 54} 25. Qxg6+ {5.13/11 35} 25... Kd8 {
>7.16/11 93} 26. Nxe6+ {5.13/11 31} 26... Bxe6 {7.34/11 54} 27. Qxe6 {5.16/12 71
>} 27... Qd6 {7.42/12 55} 28. Qxe5 {5.25/13 24} 1-0
>
>
>Nejmet is a fine program, but sometimes it just gets lost ;).
>
>
>about the analysis on the position you asked for.
>
>[D]r1b1k2r/1p1p1ppp/p2bp3/4q3/2QnP3/2N3P1/PPPBBP1P/4RRK1 b kq - 0 15
>
>
>Analysis by Nejmet_3.05 Nejmet_3.05:
>
>15...Nxc2
> = (0.00) Depth: 1/2 00:00:00
>15...Nxc2
> ³ (-0.38) Depth: 1/2 00:00:00
>15...Nxc2
> ³ (-0.38) Depth: 1/2 00:00:00
>15...Nxc2 16.Rc1
> = (-0.25) Depth: 2/4 00:00:00
>15...Nxc2 16.Rc1
> = (-0.25) Depth: 2/4 00:00:00
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5
> ³ (-0.28) Depth: 3/6 00:00:00
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5
> ³ (-0.28) Depth: 3/6 00:00:00
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6
> ³ (-0.32) Depth: 4/8 00:00:00
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6
> ³ (-0.32) Depth: 4/8 00:00:00
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6 Qxd6
> ³ (-0.32) Depth: 5/10 00:00:00
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6 Qxd6
> ³ (-0.32) Depth: 5/10 00:00:00
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6 Qxd6 18.Rd1
> = (-0.19) Depth: 6/12 00:00:00 30kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6 Qxd6 18.Rd1
> = (-0.19) Depth: 6/12 00:00:01 66kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6 Qxd6 18.Rd1 Qe5
> ³ (-0.32) Depth: 7/14 00:00:01 90kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6 Qxd6 18.Rd1 Qe5
> ³ (-0.32) Depth: 7/14 00:00:02 149kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6 Qxd6 18.Rc1 Nd4 19.Bd3
> ³ (-0.28) Depth: 8/16 00:00:02 205kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6 Qxd6 18.Rc1 Nd4 19.Bd3
> ³ (-0.28) Depth: 8/16 00:00:03 459kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6 Qxd6 18.Rc1 Nd4 19.Rfd1 e5
> ³ (-0.27) Depth: 9/18 00:00:03 634kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6 Qxd6 18.Rc1 Nd4 19.Rfd1 e5
> ³ (-0.27) Depth: 9/18 00:00:05 1190kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Rd1 Qc5 17.Qd3 Nb4 18.Qf3 0-0 19.Be3 Qe5 20.Bb6
> = (-0.20) Depth: 10/20 00:00:09 2127kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Rd1 Qc5 17.Qd3 Nb4 18.Qf3 0-0 19.Be3 Qe5 20.Bb6
> = (-0.20) Depth: 10/20 00:00:15 3604kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Rd1 Qc5 17.Qd3 Nb4 18.Qf3 0-0 19.Be3 Qc6 20.Bg5 Nc2
> = (-0.20) Depth: 11/22 00:00:22 5371kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Rd1 Qc5 17.Qd3 Nb4 18.Qf3 0-0 19.Be3 Qc6 20.Bg5 Nc2
> = (-0.20) Depth: 11/22 00:00:36 8868kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6 Qxd6 18.Rd1 Qb6 19.Qd3 Nb4 20.Qf3 0-0 21.e5
> = (-0.19) Depth: 12/24 00:01:06 15141kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6 Qxd6 18.Rd1 Qb6 19.Qd3 Nb4 20.Qf3 0-0 21.e5
> = (-0.19) Depth: 12/24 00:01:34 22968kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Rd1 Qc5 17.Na4 Qxc4 18.Bxc4 Be5 19.Rc1 Nd4 20.f4 Bf6 21.Nb6 Ne2+
>22.Bxe2 Bd4+ 23.Kg2
> = (-0.11) Depth: 13/26 00:03:09 43826kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Rd1 Qc5 17.Na4 Qxc4 18.Bxc4 Be5 19.Rc1 Nd4 20.f4 Bf6 21.Nb6 Ne2+
>22.Bxe2 Bd4+ 23.Kg2
> = (-0.11) Depth: 13/26 00:04:13 59473kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Rc1 Nd4 17.Rfd1 Be7 18.Bf4 Nxe2+ 19.Qxe2 Qf6 20.Qd3 0-0 21.e5 Qg6
>22.Qxg6 fxg6
> = (-0.03) Depth: 14/28 00:09:00 123202kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Rc1 Nd4 17.Rfd1 Be7 18.Bf4 Nxe2+ 19.Qxe2 Qf6 20.Qd3 0-0 21.e5 Qg6
>22.Qxg6 fxg6
> = (-0.03) Depth: 14/28 00:12:12 175761kN
>15...Nxc2
> = (-0.03) Depth: 15/30 00:16:03 232425kN
>15...Nxc2 16.Bf4 Qc5 17.Bxd6 Qxd6 18.Rd1 Qb6 19.a3 Qxb2 20.Na4 b5 21.Qxc8+ Rxc8
> ± (1.20) Depth: 15/30 00:18:33 270775kN
>15...Nc6
> ± (1.20) Depth: 15/30 00:29:39 422997kN
Nejmet is still better than movei here.
Movei needs only an estimated depth of 14 to find that 15...Nxc2 is losing
but unfortunately it needs estimated time of some days.
My estimate for depth 14 is based on the fact my latest version after 15...Nc2
16.Bf4 needs depth 12 to see negative score for Qc5(at smaller depth it can see
small positive score for black similiar to nejmet's scores but slightly less
optimistic for black and only at depth 12 the score is changed to more than +1
for white).
unfortunately 15...Nc2 16.Bf4 do not trigger extension and it means that movei
needs depth 14 to see the same from the root position.
movei needs more than 30 minutes and more than 300M nodes to finish iteration
10.
If you assume branching factor of 4 then it means that it may need more than 2
hours to finish depth 11,more than 8 hours to finish depth 12,more than 32 hours
to finish depth 13 and more than 128 hours to finish depth 14.
Uri
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