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Subject: Re: another Deep Blue question---Robert

Author: Uri Blass

Date: 14:14:48 04/11/02

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On April 11, 2002 at 16:47:57, Robert Hyatt wrote:

>On April 11, 2002 at 15:59:18, Uri Blass wrote:
>
>>
>>The fact that they change their mind to Kh1 after enough time is a proof that
>>they know enough.
>>I believe that even crafty knows enough to prefer Kh1 after enough time.
>
>As the author, I can absolutely guarantee you it doesn't "know enough".
>
>If you want, I will be happy to post a simple position where most programs
>will play the right move for the wrong reason.  And then find another similar
>position where the wrong move is played for that same wrong reason.
>
>This is about search.  Not about knowledge...
>
>
>>
>>knowing enough does not mean knowing that Qe3 is a draw but knowing that the
>>endgame after Kh1 is better than the position after Qe3.
>>
>>knowledge in evaluation does not mean knowing the final result of every position
>>but knowing better to evaluate which option is better.
>
>
>The only straw in the ointment is that "better" here is only discernable
>after a horrendously deep search to follow all the checks.  If you are sure
>the checks are tolerable, Kf1 is fine to play.  Move one pawn in the indicated
>position and Kf1 is perfectly ok.  So there is no "positional reason" to prefer
>one over the other.  There is definitely a very deep tactical reason, however...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>
>>The knoweldge in the evaluation that programs have is enough to evaluate that
>>the position many plies after Qe3 is relatively better for black than the
>>position many plies after Kh1.
>>
>>Uri
>
>
>And you trust those evaluations?  And you trust making a move because the
>static evaluation says one thing even though the search doesn't see a thing
>about what is _really_ going on?

The search can see that white gets 2 pawns for the bishop.

The evaluation can see that losing a bishop for 2 pawns is better than what
happens after Kh1 when black is losing 2 pawns.

Uri



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