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Subject: Re: Smirin vs. Shredder - a question

Author: Amir Ban

Date: 15:24:44 04/15/02

Go up one level in this thread


On April 15, 2002 at 13:31:37, Robert Hyatt wrote:

>On April 15, 2002 at 12:46:19, Uri Blass wrote:
>
>>On April 15, 2002 at 12:29:47, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>
>>>On April 15, 2002 at 12:24:08, Mark Young wrote:
>>>
>>>>On April 15, 2002 at 11:52:41, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On April 15, 2002 at 08:56:27, Jonas Cohonas wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On April 15, 2002 at 08:17:04, Claudio A. Amorim wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>So, are these the programs supposed to play at a 2700 level? Sure, they win many
>>>>>>>games against strong humans, but... Where is their chess competency? Shredder´s
>>>>>>>errors against Smirin were so elementary that they would not fit well in a
>>>>>>>strong club player´s blitz game.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Let's not go crazy over ONE game! we need to ask these questions after the
>>>>>>match, also you can not say "So, are these the programs supposed to play at a
>>>>>>2700 level?" when this is a games based on one programs performance!
>>>>>>Other than that i agree, it was not pretty...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Regards
>>>>>>Jonas
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I think the thing that troubles _some_ of us greatly is this question:
>>>>>
>>>>>"Can you name any GM that would play a single game that looks as bad as
>>>>> that one?"
>>>>>
>>>>>Of course, questions like "OK, how can a program play like a 2600+ in one game
>>>>> then play like a 1900- in another game?"  and that _is_ a good question.  But
>>>>>as the old proverb goes, "the chain is only as strong as its weakest link."  IE
>>>>>Smirin could lose the remainder of the games (not likely of course) and it would
>>>>>_still_ be difficult to call this a "GM performance" after a game like that...
>>>>>
>>>>>GMs do have bad days.  But not _that_ bad.  It perfectly highlighted just how
>>>>>weakly programs evaluate king-safety.  _all_ programs...
>>>>
>>>>So far this is a Shredder problem, if the other programs play as badly then I
>>>>will agree with you "Huston we have a problem."
>>>
>>>Agreed...
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>We can not lable all programs the same, I have seen this type of play before
>>>>from Shredder that is why I never considered Shredder the best program, no
>>>>matter how many WC titles it has won.
>>>
>>>
>>>No idea there.  Winning a WMCCC/WCCC event is different.  Computers don't attack
>>>worth a flip.
>>
>>I disgaree that computers do not attack.
>>It is dependent on the program.
>>
>>There are games when computers even sacrifice material for attack and in this
>>game there was no need for sacrifices.
>>
>>Uri
>
>
>Show me a computer that _really_ attacks.  I am not talking about just moving
>pieces near the opponent's king, or sacrificing a piece for two pawns to get a
>couple of open files.  I mean a program that really knows how to attack,
>period.  With bishops on opposite corner from the king, clearing the diagonals,
>etc.
>
>There just aren't any...

Computers are tremendous attackers. It's their strongest point.

Amir





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