Author: Slater Wold
Date: 21:32:42 04/30/02
Go up one level in this thread
On May 01, 2002 at 00:16:06, Vine Smith wrote: >On April 30, 2002 at 23:45:28, Slater Wold wrote: > >>On April 30, 2002 at 17:24:20, Vine Smith wrote: >> >>>On April 30, 2002 at 16:16:16, Dann Corbit wrote: >>> >>>>On April 30, 2002 at 16:01:33, Slater Wold wrote: >>>>>I can understand your frustration. You've worked just as hard as Ed or >>>>>Christophe on Rebel/Tiger. No doubt your books add a considerable amount of Elo >>>>>to these programs, and I am sure Ed and Christophe are very appreciative of >>>>>that. >>>>> >>>>>However, I must warn you that laying claim to a series of chess opening moves is >>>>>not going to be easy to defend. You cannot copyright moves in chess, as you >>>>>cannot copyright dance moves. While you can copyright a mvs book, you are >>>>>actually only copyrighting the format. Again, you cannot copyright chess moves. >>>>> >>>>>I think anyone found 'hacking' a chess program, or its book, should face a >>>>>severe punishment. Anyone claiming something is their, when in fact it is not, >>>>>should be punished. >>>>> >>>>>I am not defending these people, I am simply stating the fact that it would be >>>>>easier to encrypt the books, than to go after those stealing it. >>>> >>>>While you cannot copyright chess moves, you can copyright a particular >>>>collection as a whole. (For example, a book of analysis about Bobby Fischer's >>>>chess games can be copyrighted). >>>> >>>>I'm not a lawyer, so I don't know what the repercussions are for an opening >>>>book. But it is pretty clear that you should not simply use someone's work and >>>>claim that it is yours. >>> >>>A similar problem exists in the field of cartography, where the information >>>conveyed by a map is public domain, but its assemblage and presentation is not. >>>One approach that has been used is to include trivial, but fictitious geographic >>>elements in the map, such as small towns or lakes that don't actually exist -- >>>if your map is substantially swiped, the inclusion of these fictitious elements >>>in the copy is proof positive of plagiarism. Perhaps authors of chess program >>>books should do the same. In each significant opening, a "false" line full of >>>outrageously bad moves could be included, and the program would be "hard coded" >>>not to use them (as opposed to marking them in some way in the book itself, >>>which would be too obvious). Finding these lines in another book would >>>constitute quick and conclusive proof of intellectual theft; whether this could >>>be used for legal purposes is not clear to me, but certainly the offender could >>>be dealt with by the ICCA and other organizations according to their rules. >> >>Good idea. >> >>However, there are people who setup 20 computers to play through their books for >>weeks at a time. This would probably get rid of 99% of those bad lines. > >Who are these people? We're not talking about the most lucrative software >business in the world here, after all. Who has the time and resources to do >this? If they did, wouldn't it be easier to just compile their own book? Anyway, >the point isn't so much to sow the book with bad lines (although it would be >gratifying if a program using a pirated copy actually played one of them), but >with "signatures", moves whose presence could not be adequately explained except >by copying from another source. So 99% removal will still leave 1% of the >signatures, and even one such line would suffice. Also, I suppose the moves >don't have to be so very bad -- just a series of pointless maneuvers will do. >But unless the reverse engineering team you hypothesize has a GM member, who >will be able to quickly distinguish between truly pointless maneuvers and the >subtleties that masters engage in? Not the program itself -- if it could do >this, it wouldn't need a book. Well, it's not time. Computers do all the work. Having 20 computers is might be an overstatement. But I would think 3 would do. And hey, I have 3 computers. ;)
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