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Subject: Re: HIARCS 8 vs Fritz 7 , Here are The FIRST 2 GAMES + Plus Some !

Author: Jorge Pichard

Date: 04:52:19 05/13/02

Go up one level in this thread


On May 13, 2002 at 05:51:24, Jorge Pichard wrote:

>On May 12, 2002 at 23:04:58, Terry McCracken wrote:
>
>>On May 12, 2002 at 22:50:05, Terry McCracken wrote:
>>
>>>On May 12, 2002 at 22:21:41, Jorge Pichard wrote:
>>>
>>>>I started a long long time control match of approximately 4 minutes per move and
>>>>HIARCS 8 is winning 2 games and ZERO lost so far, against one of the very best
>>>>program available Fritz 7. It seems to me that HIARCS 8 is an excellent program
>>>>at longer time control and could also be used wisely in correspondence.
>>>>
>>>>PS: Once the newer Pentium 3.0 Ghz becomes available this program will be among
>>>>the very best available , and that could be in another 6 six months.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Pichard.
>>>
>>>This is my theory, but no one buys it! It's "Common Sense" IMO. Regardless how
>>>fast a programme may be it will hit a "Wall" with iterative deepening as the
>>>tree grows larger exponentially. So Hiarcs will catch up over time, regardless
>>>of it's slow node count (slowest I've Seen) and lower iterations  in fast games.
>>>
>>>Time will tell;)
>
>

>>
>>2-0 is not a significant result.
>>
>>I do not believe that hiarcs is better at longer time control.
>>
>>It is possible that programs that have better positional understanding are going
>>to get better results at slower time control(I do not know) but Hiarcs has not
>>better positional understanding based on other posts.
>>
>>There are positions when it may be better than other programs but there are also
>>positions when it may be worse than other programs.
>>
>>Uri
>
>
>If it was based on position then it would have lost the second game, since it is
>the same opening but with the black pieces.
>
>
>
>Hiarcs 8 (2700) - Fritz 7 (2715) [E86]
>Athlon 1.2 Ghz, 120'/30+120'/30+30' My Place (1), 12.05.2002
>
>W=13.2 ply; 125kN/s
>B=14.9 ply; 686kN/s
> 1.d4 ¤f6 2.c4 g6 3.¤c3 ¥g7 4.e4 d6 5.f3 0-0 6.¥e3 e5 7.¤ge2 c6 8.£d2 ¤bd7
>9.0-0-0 a6 10.¢b1 b5 11.¤c1 White last book move 11...£e7 12.dxe5  0.96/13  9:27
> dxe5 Black last book move 13.¤b3  0.96/13  8:26  £b4  0.56/14  7:41  14.£d6
>1.08/12  5:16  £xd6  0.75/16  6:30  15.¦xd6  1.08/13  3:26  b4 (¤b8)  0.81/16
>7:43  16.¤a4  1.40/14  6:06  ¤e8  1.09/17  12:25  17.¦d2  1.48/13  4:21  f5
>1.16/16  9:03  18.¤a5 (¥d3)  1.53/13  6:22  18...fxe4  0.78/15  5:31  19.¤xc6
>1.59/12  3:00  ¤ef6  0.81/14  4:40  20.c5 (¤xb4)  1.77/12  6:41  20...exf3 (¢h8)
> 1.00/14  4:53  21.gxf3  1.84/12  5:40  ¥b7 (b3)  1.25/15  10:57  22.¤e7+
>3.36/13  6:47  ¢f7  2.00/16  5:16  23.c6  3.40/13  5:05  ¢xe7  2.41/14  5:41
>24.cxb7  4.15/13  5:29  ¦ab8 (¦ad8)  2.84/14  5:31  25.¥xa6  4.14/13  5:28  e4
>(b3)  3.41/14  24:04  26.¥f4  5.35/12  7:13  ¢e6 (b3)  3.34/12  1:49  27.¥xb8
>5.53/11  6:28  ¦xb8  3.50/14  1:38  28.fxe4  5.52/13  6:37  ¥h6  3.81/14  1:36
>29.¦d4  5.63/14  8:58  b3  3.84/14  1:54  30.axb3 (¦hd1)  5.78/13  4:29
>30...¥f4  3.34/13  1:36  31.h3  5.85/13  3:39  ¢e7 (¥e3)  3.53/14  3:24  32.¦c4
>5.97/13  4:10  ¥e5 (g5)  3.84/15  8:10  33.¦d1  6.17/13  3:07  ¥f4 (g5)  4.44/14
> 4:27  34.¤c3  6.65/13  3:42  h5 (¥e5)  4.94/13  2:50  35.¦c8  7.58/12  3:22
>¢e6 (g5)  5.37/13  3:23  36.¤b5  8.57/12  2:26  ¢e5  5.66/12  3:02  37.¤a7 (¦e1)
> 9.91/13  3:36  37...¢xe4  6.37/14  16:52  38.¤c6  10.05/12  2:31  ¥h2 (¢f5)
>7.69/13  14:31  39.¤xb8  13.70/12  3:44  ¤xb8  8.97/14  2:26  40.¥d3+  13.97/12
>3:22  ¢f3  9.44/14  3:15  41.¥xg6  14.41/12  3:24  ¤fd7 (¥e5)  11.91/14  8:52
>1-0
>
>
>
>
>Fritz 7 (2700) - Hiarcs 8 (2690) [E86]
>Athlon 1.2 Ghz, 120'/30+120'/30+30' My Place (2), 12.05.2002
>
>W=15.4 ply; 694kN/s
>B=12.9 ply; 125kN/s
> 1.d4 ¤f6 2.c4 g6 3.¤c3 ¥g7 4.e4 d6 5.f3 0-0 6.¥e3 e5 7.¤ge2 c6 8.£d2 ¤bd7
>9.0-0-0 a6 10.¢b1 b5 11.¤c1 White last book move 11...exd4 12.¥xd4 ¦e8 13.¤b3
>¥f8 14.h4 b4 15.¤e2 a5 16.h5 c5 17.¥e3 a4 18.¤bc1 ¤xh5 19.¥g5 ¥e7 20.¥xe7 £xe7
>21.g4 ¥b7  -0.65/13  17:59  22.gxh5  0.88/16  17:54  ¥xe4+  -0.54/13  10:34
>23.fxe4  1.03/16  16:07  £xe4+  -0.52/13  11:05  24.¤d3  0.91/16  15:32  £xh1
>-0.44/13  31:38  25.¤ef4  0.91/14  4:45  £h4  -0.38/12  9:16  26.¥g2  0.97/13
>2:04  ¦ac8 (¦a6)  -0.33/12  9:03  27.hxg6  1.28/13  3:33  hxg6  -0.02/12  17:44
>28.¦h1  1.03/13  2:31  £f6 (£g3)  0.28/13  8:57  29.¥b7 (¥h3)  1.56/14  3:28
>29...¦cd8 (¦b8)  0.00/12  2:14  30.¥c6 (£h2)  1.53/14  3:18  30...a3 (¤b6)
>0.00/11  2:00  31.b3 (£h2)  1.81/14  3:50  31...£g7  0.17/12  4:57  32.£g2 (£f2)
> 1.84/14  4:20  32...¢f8 (¦f8)  0.34/12  5:58  33.£g5 (¤d5)  1.94/13  3:09
>33...¢g8  0.16/12  12:52  34.¦h2 (¦g1)  1.75/13  2:53  34...£f6  0.04/11  2:45
>35.£h6  1.84/14  3:03  £g7  0.17/12  3:51  36.£h3 (£h4)  1.84/15  2:26  36...¦e7
> 0.02/12  1:56  37.¤d5 (¤h5)  1.72/15  5:19  37...¦e6  0.00/11  1:00  38.¤c7
>(¤5f4)  1.72/15  3:59  38...¦e7  0.00/13  2:55  39.¥xd7 (¤d5)  1.66/15  3:27
>39...¦exd7  0.00/14  3:49  40.¤d5  1.66/16  6:02  £d4 (f5)  0.00/12  2:27
>41.¦h1 (£h7+)  1.72/14  2:45  41...¢f8 (f5)  0.10/13  5:05  42.£h6+  2.13/15
>3:34  £g7  0.54/15  16:37  43.£g5  2.53/16  2:46  £d4  0.52/13  2:37  44.¦h3
>2.56/15  1:42  ¢g7  0.52/13  3:08  45.£h6+  2.38/15  2:42  ¢g8  0.52/6  0
>46.¦f3  2.16/15  2:26  £g7  0.52/13  3:35  47.¤f6+ (£g5)  2.16/14  1:45
>47...¢f8  0.41/13  1:40  48.¤xd7+  2.31/15  2:52  ¦xd7  0.42/13  2:35  49.£f4
>(£h2)  2.09/15  4:32  49...f5 (£h8)  0.45/12  3:37  50.¦e3  2.22/15  4:30  ¢f7
>0.40/13  2:07  51.£h4  2.25/16  4:49  £f6 (g5)  0.25/13  2:44  52.£h7+ (£h1)
>1.84/17  6:43  52...£g7  0.19/14  1:50  53.£h1  1.56/18  24:33  £d4  0.19/14
>4:00  54.£h6 (£h3)  1.56/16  20:03  54...£g7  0.00/14  1:57  55.£h2  -0.12/18
>16:45  ¦e7  0.00/14  4:20  56.¦g3 (¦xe7+)  0.00/17  7:09  56...¦e6 (£d4)
>-0.13/12  3:36  57.¦g2 (£f2)  0.56/16  5:03  57...£d4  -0.23/12  3:10  58.£h7+
>0.25/16  4:03  ¢f8 (£g7)  -0.17/13  3:44  59.£h6+  0.00/16  6:18  ¢e8 (¢e7)
>-0.02/14  7:20  60.¤c1 (¦d2)  0.22/17  7:15  60...£e4+  -0.68/13  1:55  61.¦c2
>0.13/17  2:26  f4  -0.68/13  1:04  62.£h3  0.22/15  37  f3 (¢d7)  -0.67/12  1:00
> 63.¤d3  0.00/15  1:08  g5 (¢d7)  -0.67/12  59  64.¦d2  0.00/13  32  g4
>-0.84/11  57  65.£h4 (£h8+)  -0.44/13  1:38  65...£g6  -1.47/10  40  66.£h8+
>(£f2)  -0.97/13  1:55  66...¢f7  -1.76/11  47  67.£c8  -0.78/12  40  ¢g7 (¦e1+)
>-2.01/11  53  68.£b7+  -1.09/12  46  £f7  -2.49/11  35  69.£c6 (£xf7+)  -1.62/13
> 1:06  69...g3  -4.07/10  42  70.¦d1  -2.25/12  49  ¦g6  -4.33/10  36  71.¢c1
>(£d5)  -2.62/12  1:30  71...g2  -5.20/11  40  72.¦g1  -2.94/13  30  f2  -5.45/11
> 34  73.¤xf2  -3.19/13  20  £xf2 (£f4+)  -5.70/11  44  74.£d7+  -3.53/13  1:19
>¢f6  -6.26/12  43  75.£xd6+  -3.56/13  1:12  ¢g5  -6.26/11  31  76.£d2+ (¦xg2+)
>-5.31/13  26  76...£xd2+  -12.25/15  27  77.¢xd2  -6.56/17  4  ¢f4  -12.74/16
>27  78.¢e2  -8.28/19  33  ¢g3  -12.99/15  29  79.¢e3 (¢d3)  -9.62/16  15
>79...¦e6+  -#16/13  7  80.¢d3 (¢d2)  -8.56/17  52  0-1


On May 11, 2002 at 08:33:36, Jorge Pichard wrote:

>It is up to you to judge playing strength at different time control!
>
>Hiarcs 8 (2700) - Shredder Paderborn (2706) [B25]
>Athlon 1.2 Ghz, 120'/40+120'/20+30' My Place (1), 09.05.2002
>
>W=12.3 ply; 158kN/s
>B=13.5 ply; 325kN/s
> 1.e4 c5 2.Nc3 Nc6 3.g3 g6 4.Bg2 Bg7 5.d3 d6 6.f4 e6 7.Nf3 Nge7 8.0-0 0-0 9.Be3
>Nd4 10.e5 Nef5 11.Bf2 Nxf3+ 12.Qxf3 Nd4 13.Qd1 dxe5 14.fxe5 Bxe5 15.Ne4 f5
>16.Nxc5 Qd6 17.b4 Nc6 18.Rb1 Bd4 19.Qd2 a5 20.Bxc6 Bxf2+ 21.Qxf2 bxc6 Both last
>book move 22.b5  0.14/13  12:25  cxb5  0.57/12  45  23.Rxb5  0.14/13  8:14  e5
>0.69/14  7:43  24.Qf3 (Rfb1)  0.10/11  7:06  24...Be6  0.65/13  7:07  25.Nxe6
>0.20/12  6:30  Qxe6  0.51/16  5:52  26.Re1 (Qd5)  0.24/12  4:49  26...Qxa2
>0.40/15  14:10  27.Rbxe5  0.02/11  6:10  Rad8  0.23/13  5:59  28.Re7 (Qf2)
>0.20/12  5:44  28...Qxc2 (Qd5)  0.30/11  1:16  29.Qe3  0.24/12  4:59  Qc6
>0.25/12  5:33  30.Rc1 (Qh6)  1.72/11  5:49  30...f4  1.34/12  5:43  31.gxf4
>1.98/11  4:21  Qd6  1.67/13  9:35  32.Rcc7  1.73/12  3:58  Rf5  1.43/13  5:46
>33.Rg7+  1.73/12  4:40  Kf8  1.58/13  11:13  34.Rxh7  1.73/12  4:50  Kg8
>1.32/13  9:12  35.Rcg7+  2.05/11  6:43  Kf8  1.32/7  0  36.Rb7  1.80/12  20:09
>Kg8  1.25/11  1:07  37.Kg2  1.53/11  4:47  Qd5+  1.24/12  8:23  38.Kf2  1.45/12
>3:22  Qd4  1.21/13  6:39  39.Rbg7+ (Qxd4)  1.16/11  3:57  39...Kf8  1.20/12  39
>40.Qxd4  1.16/11  39  Rxd4  1.37/11  22  41.Ke3 (Rxg6)  1.33/13  6:02  41...Rfd5
> 1.30/14  5:38  42.Rxg6 (Rf7+)  1.29/13  9:03  42...Rxd3+  1.23/13  23  43.Ke4
>1.28/13  5:05  R3d4+  1.19/15  6:32  44.Kf3  1.28/13  4:26  Rf5  1.23/15  11:03
>45.Rg4  1.27/12  6:00  a4 (Rd3+)  1.35/14  7:56  46.h4 (Ra7)  1.13/12  9:00
>46...Rc4 (Rb4)  1.25/15  14:16  47.h5 (Ra7)  1.38/11  5:24  47...a3  1.28/14
>16:25  48.h6  1.21/12  8:43  Ra4 (Rf6)  1.28/12  3:59  49.Rh8+  1.74/11  5:34
>Ke7 (Kf7)  1.89/14  9:23  50.h7  2.21/12  7:19  Rh5  2.04/13  8:14  51.Rg7+
>2.21/12  5:24  Kf6 (Ke6)  1.68/12  4:25  52.Rb7 (Rg5)  2.26/11  3:32  52...a2
>0.91/12  4:09  53.Rf8+  1.63/12  16:00  Kg6  0.93/13  3:41  54.Rg8+ (h8Q)
>1.63/12  4:09  54...Kf5 (Kf6)  0.87/13  4:00  55.Rb5+  1.38/12  6:01  Ke6
>0.87/13  8:11  56.Rxh5 (Rg6+)  1.38/11  3:11  56...a1Q  0.02/12  4:00  57.Re5+
>(Re8+)  1.13/11  9:48  57...Kd6  0.01/13  3:29  58.Rg6+ (Rd8+)  0.09/11  3:55
>58...Kd7 (Kc7)  0.01/13  4:19  59.Rg7+  0.00/11  58  Kd6  0.00/14  4:15  60.Rg6+
> 0.00/11  29  Kd7  0.00/13  2:13  61.Rg7+  0.00/12  1:01  Kd6  0.00/13  53
>62.Rg6+ Draw accepted  0.00/11  59  ½-½
>
>
>
>Shredder Paderborn (2706) - Hiarcs 8 (2700) [B25]
>Athlon 1.2 Ghz, 120'/40+120'/20+30' My Place (2), 09.05.2002
>
>W=13.9 ply; 280kN/s
>B=11.3 ply; 135kN/s
> 1.e4 c5 2.Nc3 Nc6 3.g3 g6 4.Bg2 Bg7 5.d3 d6 6.f4 e6 7.Nf3 Nge7 8.0-0 0-0 9.Be3
>Nd4 10.e5 Nef5 11.Bf2 Nxf3+ 12.Qxf3 Nd4 13.Qd1 dxe5 14.fxe5 Bxe5 15.Ne4 f5
>16.Nxc5 Qd6 17.b4 Nc6 18.Rb1 Bd4 19.Qd2 a5 20.Bxc6 Bxf2+ 21.Qxf2 bxc6 Both last
>book move 22.a4  0.99/15  5:51  e5  0.06/12  6:42  23.c3 (b5)  0.94/12  43
>23...f4 (Ba6)  0.00/12  9:20  24.gxf4  0.94/14  12:03  Rxf4  -0.04/11  5:38
>25.Qa2+  1.11/12  56  Kg7  0.02/12  6:15  26.Rxf4  1.01/13  6:40  exf4  0.02/11
>2:32  27.Qc4 (Qf2)  1.09/14  5:12  27...axb4 (Bh3)  -0.01/11  9:04  28.cxb4
>(Ne4)  1.03/14  10:07  28...Bh3  -0.06/11  7:05  29.a5 (Qc3+)  0.90/13  8:35
>29...Qf6 (Rf8)  -0.37/12  6:11  30.Ne4  1.28/12  35  Qh4  -0.21/12  8:49
>31.Qd4+  0.92/14  8:16  Kh6  -0.21/12  5:55  32.Qf2  0.88/15  5:40  Qg4+
>-0.12/12  5:59  33.Kh1  0.88/15  11:07  Rf8  0.00/11  5:53  34.Rg1  0.95/14
>5:43  Qd7  -0.12/11  6:07  35.Qc5  0.94/13  4:02  Rf5  -0.15/11  5:51  36.Qc3
>(Qf2)  0.61/14  12:17  36...Qd5 (Rf8)  -0.34/11  5:51  37.Qd2 (a6)  0.80/13
>5:33  37...g5 (Rf8)  -0.39/11  3:20  38.Rc1  1.56/13  4:21  f3 (Re5)  -0.08/12
>12:02  39.Nf2 (Qe3)  0.91/14  8:35  39...Re5  -0.84/11  2:28  40.Qb2 (Qc3)
>-0.07/11  3:06  40...Kg6 (Qd6)  -0.84/11  2:46  41.Ne4 (Qc3)  -0.50/13  12:40
>41...Qxd3  -2.23/13  12:12  42.Nf2  -1.40/13  8:06  Qe2  -2.27/12  5:49  43.Qb1+
> -1.40/13  10:02  Bf5  -2.05/13  8:48  44.Rxc6+  -1.43/14  4:04  Kh5  -2.05/13
>4:14  45.Qg1  -1.93/15  8:10  Qd2  -2.07/12  4:01  46.Rc1  -1.68/15  10:50  Qxb4
> -2.08/12  5:50  47.a6  -1.34/14  5:37  Ra5  -2.33/12  5:50  48.Qd1 (Ra1)
>-1.40/13  3:19  48...Qa3  -3.27/12  4:58  49.Qd2  -1.52/13  3:55  h6  -3.52/11
>4:26  50.Rg1  -1.55/13  3:29  Rxa6 (Qc5)  -3.35/12  9:16  51.Qd5 (h4)  -1.55/13
>4:59  51...Rf6  -3.46/12  5:44  52.Qe5  -1.68/14  8:18  Qd6 (Kg6)  -3.55/12
>4:54  53.Qe8+ (Qc3)  -1.77/13  3:33  53...Bg6 (Rg6)  -3.74/12  5:50  54.Qe3
>-1.78/14  5:55  Qf4  -3.78/12  3:55  55.Rg3  -1.99/14  7:59  Bf7  -3.84/12  4:29
> 56.Qc3 (Qd3)  -2.08/13  4:23  56...Bd5 (Qf5)  -3.99/13  7:17  57.Qe1 (Qd3)
>-2.43/13  4:28  57...Rc6  -4.23/13  6:16  58.Qe8+  -3.12/13  2:13  Qf7  -4.23/13
> 4:42  59.Qe1 (Qxf7+)  -4.40/13  5:54  59...Rc2  -6.07/12  3:36  60.Qe3 (Kg1)
>-5.51/12  2:08  60...Re2  -8.98/12  5:15  61.Qb6 (Qd4)  -5.50/12  31  61...Qf5
>(Qe6)  -19.05/11  35  62.h3 (Qb5)  -12.84/11  58  62...Qf4 (Qe5)  -19.68/12  51
>63.Kh2 (Rg1)  -#60/17  1:22  63...Qd2  -#8/8  3  64.Kh1 (Rg1)  -#7/20  31
>64...Rxf2  -#6/7  10  65.Qxf2  -#5/13  1:14  Qxf2  -#5/6  0  66.Rg1 (Rg4)
>-#4/11  36  66...Kg6 (Qd2)  -#6/1  0  67.Rg4  -#4/11  1:08  Qf1+ (Qe2)  -#4/4  0
> 68.Kh2  -#4/11  16  f2 (Qe2+)  -#3/3  0  69.Rxg5+ (h4)  -#2/12  4  69...hxg5
>-#2/1  0  70.Kg3  -#1/10  23  Qg1# -#1/1  0  0-1
>
>
I will have two additional games by tomorrow morning, I will start the engines
now.

Pichard.



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