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Subject: Re: Rating swings on ICC

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 05:01:28 08/02/98

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On July 31, 1998 at 20:51:56, Bruce Moreland wrote:

>
>On July 31, 1998 at 14:00:04, Peter Fendrich wrote:
>
>>The ratings on ICC and FICS are really swinging. IMHO they are using a
>>completely wrong approach to handle this. The ELO formula is not at all suited
>>for the kind of events taking place on these real time severs. The original ELO
>>formula is using a kind of constant a 'dampening' factor for varitaions during
>>time. At least on ICC they have tried to use another, more dynamic but similar
>>method to handle this problem. There are new, much better, ways to deal with
>>this. Nowerdays used within some of the space, aero and automotive applications.
>
>Both ICC and FICS tried to use the Glicko system.
>
>On ICC, they made it an "extra" rating system, but I don't think anyone paid
>much attention to this, so it is removed from the "finger" notes.  It is still
>there, but to see it you have to use "yfinger".
>
>On FICS, they made this the only rating system.  I am not there much, but I
>remember seeing a lot of posts about this, people were upset about this system
>because if you played a lot, your rating tended to stay constant no matter how
>you did, and people wanted to have more movement in their ratings.  So I believe
>that on FICS they patched Glicko somehow, so that ratings would still move a
>bit.
>
>bruce


the problem with "Elo" is that the "K" factor was statistically derived from
the typical number of rated games a person would reasonably play in a year, and
the max expected rating change of a person over that time frame.  It is totally
wrong for a server where (say) a program plays 20,000 games per year.  Because
we see the huge swings that result from this.  Chances are that if you are a
2,000 player today, you will be a 2,000 player in 6 months, regardless of how
many games you play,  So it would be difficult to pick a formula that is fair
to those playing a dozen games a year and to those playing thousands.




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