Author: Uri Blass
Date: 01:53:56 07/13/02
Go up one level in this thread
On July 13, 2002 at 03:28:12, Peter McKenzie wrote: >On July 12, 2002 at 13:31:31, Will Singleton wrote: > >>I didn't see any discussion of this game, the pgn was not available for awhile. >>It appears to me that the game was drawn, but Warp picked the wrong move in the >>following position (fxg5). If Bxa5 draws, then Junior was indeed lucky to win >>the tournament. > >the game started about an hour late because the junior guys had a hard disk >failure and were installing all their tablebases on the new machine. i was >quite happy for this to happen. > >my random thoughts on the game, although i haven't analysed it yet and won't be >for a while as i am now on holiday for a couple of weeks; > >the game itself was exciting. warp played the first dubious move with nfg5, but >it wasn't too serious and the game was still about level. then junior played a >series of suspect moves such as ra6, h5, h4. warp had a good game, and then i >think junior unsoundly sacrificed a pawn. warp accepted it and defended well, >winning another pawn in the process. > >so warp is 2 pawns up but junior has a nice blockade and there is no easy way >for warp to make progress. probably warp should sacrifice the c-pawn, or even >sacrifice the exchange. i think the position is objectively winning but my >program doesn't see a good plan. > >eventually we get near the 50-move rule and also repetitions are an issue. warp >has the idea of moving is bishop over to a3 to push the c-pawn. good idea, but >not sound because of juniors wonderful f5. at this late stage of the game the >thinking time is much reduced, so warp is not searching deep enough to see f5 >coming. soon after f5 warp thinks it is a draw but a few moves later i think it >thought it could avoid the draw and maintain a small plus which obviously was >incorrect. junior was showing a draw score for a while too, so i suspect you >are right and a draw was possible. in the end warp just wasn't up to the task, >and junior played very well. i was satisfied with how my program handled the >middlegame, but i must work on getting a bit more search depth to be fully >competitive. of course, playing with 1.7ghz vs 2x2ghz doesn't make it easy >either. > >i wonder how long programs need for f5, good test position i suspect. Some analysis by chess programs. Junior7 cannot find it even at depth 20(p850 64 Mbytes hash) Warp - Deep Junior 7 [D]4q3/5pbk/b1r5/p1rNp1p1/P1P1P1P1/2R1PP1p/Q1RB3P/6K1 b - - 0 1 Analysis by Junior 7: 59...f5 60.exf5 +- (1.46) Depth: 3 00:00:00 59...f6 60.Rc1 ² (0.40) Depth: 3 00:00:00 59...Bf8 60.f4 = (0.23) Depth: 3 00:00:00 59...Qd8 60.f4 = (0.19) Depth: 3 00:00:00 59...Qf8 60.f4 = (0.17) Depth: 3 00:00:00 59...Qf8 60.Qb3 Qd6 ² (0.34) Depth: 6 00:00:00 1kN 59...Qb8 60.Ne7 Rb6 61.Qa1 ² (0.32) Depth: 6 00:00:00 2kN 59...Rc8 60.Rc1 R5c6 ² (0.26) Depth: 6 00:00:00 3kN 59...Rc8 60.Rc1 R5c6 61.R3c2 Qd8 ² (0.28) Depth: 9 00:00:00 15kN 59...Bf8 60.f4 Qc8 61.f5 Bxc4 62.Nf6+ Rxf6 63.Rxc4 ² (0.27) Depth: 9 00:00:00 36kN 59...Bf8 60.Bc1 Qc8 61.Ba3 Bxc4 62.Qb2 Bd3 63.Bxc5 Bxc2 64.Rxc2 Bxc5 65.Qxe5 ² (0.54) Depth: 12 00:00:00 234kN 59...Qd7 60.Bc1 Re6 61.Ba3 Rc8 62.Qb3 Rec6 ² (0.39) Depth: 12 00:00:00 428kN 59...Rc8 60.Bc1 R5c6 61.Ba3 Re6 62.f4 Qxa4 ² (0.33) Depth: 12 00:00:01 625kN 59...Rc8 60.Bc1 R5c6 61.Ba3 Rb8 62.Be7 Qc8 63.Bxg5 ² (0.57) Depth: 15 00:00:03 2519kN 59...Bf8 60.Bc1 Qc8 61.Ba3 Rxc4 62.Bxf8 Rxc3 63.Rxc3 Rxc3 64.Nxc3 Qxf8 65.Qd5 Qe7 ² (0.41) Depth: 15 00:00:05 3627kN 59...Bf8 60.Bc1 Rh6 61.Ba3 Rc8 62.Bxf8 Qxf8 63.Qa1 Rhc6 64.Qf1 Rh6 ± (0.85) Depth: 17 00:00:16 10690kN 59...Kh8 60.Bc1 Re6 61.Bb2 Qd7 62.Qb3 Qc8 63.Ba3 Rcc6 64.Be7 ² (0.56) Depth: 17 00:00:21 14821kN 59...Rc8 60.Qa1 R5c6 61.Qf1 Rh6 ² (0.38) Depth: 17 00:00:41 29309kN 59...Rc8 60.Qa1 R8c6 61.Qd1 Re6 62.Rb2 Rd6 63.Qf1 Qxa4 64.Ne7 Rh6 ² (0.38) Depth: 19 00:01:52 76730kN 59...Rc8 60.Kf2 R8c6 61.Bc1 Re6 62.Kg1 Rc8 ² (0.41) Depth: 20 00:07:25 292574kN (blass, tel-aviv 13.07.2002) Movei needs almost 10 minutes to fail high on f5 but it is faster than Junior7 in analysis mode. 12 -103 52169 66246874 g7f8 d2c1 e8c8 c1a3 a6c4 a2b2 c4d5 a3c5 f8c5 e4d5 c5e3 g1h1 c6c3 c2c3 12 -102 59380 75883627 f7f5 12 -82 64884 83409576 f7f5 d2c1 f5g4 c1a3 g4f3 a3c5 c6c5 c2f2 g5g4 a2b3 h7g8 c3c1 12 -82 65905 84696998 f7f5 d2c1 f5g4 c1a3 g4f3 a3c5 c6c5 c2f2 g5g4 a2b3 h7g8 c3c1 13 -84 73397 94371749 f7f5 d2c1 f5g4 c1a3 g4f3 a3c5 c6c5 c2c1 e8h5 a2f2 h5g4 f2g3 g4g3 h2g3 h7g6 g1f2 Deep fritz is even faster Warp - Deep Junior 7 4q3/5pbk/b1r5/p1rNp1p1/P1P1P1P1/2R1PP1p/Q1RB3P/6K1 b - - 0 1 Analysis by Deep Fritz: 59...Rxd5-- +- (2.81) Depth: 1/3 00:00:00 59...Rxd5-- 60.cxd5 +- (3.69) Depth: 1/5 00:00:00 59...Qe6! +- (2.22) Depth: 1/7 00:00:00 59...Qe6! +- (1.62) Depth: 1/7 00:00:00 59...Qe6 60.Qb3 +- (1.66) Depth: 2/9 00:00:00 59...Qc8! +- (1.62) Depth: 2/22 00:00:00 59...Qc8! 60.Ne7 ± (1.37) Depth: 2/22 00:00:00 59...Qc8-- +- (1.72) Depth: 3/10 00:00:00 59...Qc8-- 60.Ne7 Qe8 61.Nxc6 +- (2.91) Depth: 3/10 00:00:00 59...Qe6! +- (2.84) Depth: 3/10 00:00:00 59...Qe6! 60.Qb3 Rd6 +- (1.56) Depth: 3/13 00:00:00 59...Qe6 60.Qb3 Qc8 61.Ne7 +- (1.47) Depth: 4/23 00:00:00 2kN 59...Qe6 60.Qb3 Kh8 61.Qb8+ Rc8 62.Qb3 +- (1.69) Depth: 5/22 00:00:00 4kN 59...Rd6! +- (1.66) Depth: 5/22 00:00:00 7kN 59...Rd6! 60.Qa1 +- (1.59) Depth: 5/22 00:00:00 9kN 59...Rd6-- +- (1.91) Depth: 6/24 00:00:00 27kN 59...Rd6-- +- (1.91) Depth: 6/24 00:00:00 27kN 59...Qe6! +- (1.87) Depth: 6/24 00:00:00 28kN 59...Qe6! 60.Bc1 Qh6 61.Bb2 Qh4 62.Rc1 +- (1.72) Depth: 6/24 00:00:00 36kN 59...Qe6-- +- (2.03) Depth: 7/20 00:00:00 83kN 59...Qe6-- 60.Bc1 Rc8 61.Ba3 R5c6 62.Be7 Qg6 +- (2.06) Depth: 7/20 00:00:00 92kN 59...Rd6! +- (2.03) Depth: 7/20 00:00:00 103kN 59...Rd6! 60.Bc1 Rd8 61.Ba3 Rcc8 62.Qb3 Qe6 +- (1.91) Depth: 7/22 00:00:00 110kN 59...Bf8! +- (1.87) Depth: 7/26 00:00:00 131kN 59...Bf8! 60.Qb1 Kg8 61.Qf1 Rh6 62.Qa1 Rd6 +- (1.62) Depth: 7/26 00:00:00 167kN 59...f5! +- (1.59) Depth: 7/26 00:00:00 191kN 59...f5! 60.gxf5 Qh5 61.Kf2 g4 62.fxg4 Qxg4 63.Ke1 +- (1.53) Depth: 7/26 00:00:00 201kN 59...f5 60.gxf5 Qh5 61.Kf2 g4 62.fxg4 Qxg4 63.Ke1 Qh4+ 64.Kd1 Qxe4 +- (1.53) Depth: 8/25 00:00:00 271kN 59...f5 60.gxf5 Qh5 61.Kf2 g4 62.Bc1 Qh4+ 63.Ke2 gxf3+ 64.Kxf3 Rd6 +- (1.78) Depth: 9/30 00:00:00 403kN 59...Bf8! +- (1.75) Depth: 9/30 00:00:00 415kN 59...Bf8! 60.Qb1 Kg8 61.Qf1 Rh6 62.Qa1 Rd6 63.Rc1 Qe6 +- (1.47) Depth: 9/30 00:00:01 640kN 59...Bf8-- +- (1.78) Depth: 10/32 00:00:01 1190kN 59...Bf8-- 60.Bc1 Qc8 61.Ba3 Rxc4 62.Bxf8 Rxc3 63.Rxc3 Rxc3 64.Nxc3 Qxf8 65.Qd5 +- (1.81) Depth: 10/32 00:00:02 1250kN 59...f5! +- (1.78) Depth: 10/32 00:00:02 1552kN 59...f5! 60.gxf5 Qh5 61.Kf2 g4 62.Bc1 Qh4+ 63.Kf1 g3 64.hxg3 Qxg3 65.Ba3 +- (1.72) Depth: 10/32 00:00:02 1618kN 59...f5 60.gxf5 Qh5 61.Kf2 Qh4+ 62.Ke2 g4 63.Rc1 gxf3+ 64.Kxf3 Qh5+ 65.Kf2 +- (1.44) Depth: 11/29 00:00:03 2352kN 59...Bf8! +- (1.41) Depth: 11/31 00:00:04 3064kN 59...Bf8 60.Bc1 Qc8 61.Ba3 Bxc4 62.Qb2 Bxd5 63.Bxc5 Bxc5 64.exd5 Bxe3+ 65.Kh1 +- (1.66) Depth: 12/29 00:00:06 4279kN 59...f5! +- (1.62) Depth: 12/32 00:00:06 4611kN 59...f5! 60.gxf5 Qh5 61.Kf2 Qh4+ 62.Ke2 g4 63.Bc1 gxf3+ 64.Kxf3 Qh5+ 65.Kg3 ± (1.19) Depth: 12/34 00:00:07 5554kN 59...f5 60.exf5 e4 61.f6 Bxf6 62.Nxf6+ Rxf6 63.f4 Qg8 64.f5 Rfc6 65.Rc1 ± (0.97) Depth: 13/35 00:00:22 16915kN (blass, tel-aviv 13.07.2002) Uri
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