Author: Uri Blass
Date: 05:26:33 08/27/02
Go up one level in this thread
On August 27, 2002 at 07:53:58, Arturo Ochoa wrote: >On August 27, 2002 at 05:31:44, Mogens Larsen wrote: > >>On August 26, 2002 at 17:37:56, Arturo Ochoa wrote: >> >>>Hello: >>> >>>No, it is not better and it doesn't have any sense. As you declared in the long >>>thread below, you believe (but it is not demonstrated) that a engine with book >>>is not better than a engine without it. >> >>The problem with matching two identical engines with and without book is the >>deterministic nature of the games due to identical evaluation. Some would call >>that an advantage, ie. a more truthful picture of the situation after the book. >>However, that doesn't simulate actual matchplay conditions. The ponder >>percentages are lower (if played with ponder) and the hashtables less likely to >>be filled with "correct" information. The other problem is identical or very >>similar games. Here learning won't usually help the bookless engine. >> >>Furthermore, it doesn't follow that the book advantage is tranferable to matches >>against other engines. My conjecture is that if you use the same book (eg. same >>PGN collection) in matchups between different sets of identical engines, some >>will display a difference and some none at all. Maybe even do worse. I also >>suspect that the ELO difference will decrease with extra time on the clock. > >I have a single question to this interesting analysis: Why three different >engines and now Yace are establising a remarkable difference in this kind of >Matches? > >I would like to know: The Match Yace is not 12-6 for Yace with Book against Yace >without Book. > >Is this not remarkable? In other engines matches of the Top, the difference was >12-8, 13-7. Is this not remarkable? > > >>Here I agree with Uri's >>suggestion. Some kind of gauntlet seems better if you want to test the case no >>book vs. book. >> > >The problem is real: The premise established by him was: A engine can solve the >majority of the opening problems and an engine with book is not better that the >same engine without book. Solving the majority of the problems does not mean that the engine with book is not better. > >Tell me, a gaunlet can solve this? How? gaunlet means to play against different opponents and not playing again and again against the same opponent. In tournaments except ssdf you do not play again and again against the same opponent. Uri
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