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Subject: Re: endgame position, score +8 "easy" win, and spoiled to draw by engines

Author: Andrew Williams

Date: 14:36:42 09/15/02

Go up one level in this thread


On September 15, 2002 at 15:38:25, Dieter Buerssner wrote:

Hi Dieter,

I wish my program could get into positions like this against Tiger!


All of these results are on an Athlon 1200. I searched each position for two
minutes.

>
>8/8/4K1p1/4PpB1/3p1P1P/5n2/4k3/8 b - - bm d3; c0 "Nxg5 only draws";
>

PostModernist drops Nxg5 at ply 4 and switches to d3.

>After d3 Kf7
>
>8/5K2/6p1/4PpB1/5P1P/3p1n2/4k3/8 b - - bm d2; c0 "Nxg5 only draws";
>

PM drops Nxg5 at ply 2 and switches to d2

>After d2 e6
>
>8/5K2/4P1p1/5pB1/5P1P/5n2/3pk3/8 b - - bm d1=Q; c0 "Nxg5 only draws";
>

PM doesn't consider Nxg5 here at all. It goes straight for d1=Q.

>after d1Q e7
>
>8/4PK2/6p1/5pB1/5P1P/5n2/4k3/3q4 b - - bm Qd7; c0 "Nxg5 only draws";
>
>After Qd7 Kf8, black has a nice winning line: Nd4 e8Q+ Ne6+ Qxe6+ Qxe6: three
>checks in a row. More difficult for engines to win seems Qd7 Bf6 Ke3 Kf8:
>

PM likes Qd5 until 31 seconds, at which point it switches to Qd7 (ply 13).


>5K2/3qP3/5Bp1/5p2/5P1P/4kn2/8/8 b - - bm Kxf4;
>
>There are more ways to win, and what can happen here: The black side does not
>want to give his Q for the pawn, and do many Q moves. In the end, it must give
>the Q anyway, and it may very well end in a draw (at least with fast playing, my
>engined did this stupid thing). So, I think, Kxf4 is the only convincing
>immediate move.
>

PM likes Qd6 in this position. It has a score of +7.44, but its line suggests it
doesn't know how to make progress.

>The first position after Nxg5.
>[D] 8/8/4K1p1/4Ppn1/3p1P1P/8/4k3/8 w - -
>
>How does your engine evaluate this position? Are there any engines, that see
>something close to draw value (or even say smaller 5 after some time)?
>

PM is quite clueless about this. It thinks that black is at +8.98. Even after
three minutes, PM says +6.44 for Black.


Andrew




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