Author: Kurt Widmann
Date: 21:00:38 09/21/02
Go up one level in this thread
On September 21, 2002 at 23:33:25, Robert Hyatt wrote: >On September 21, 2002 at 12:35:05, Kurt Widmann wrote: > >>What is your evaluation of this position? >> >>XABCDEFGHY >>8-+-+r+-+( >>7+-+-+k+p' >>6p+-+-+pzP& >>5+-+-+l+-% >>4-+-vL-+-zP$ >>3zPp+-+-+-# >>2-zP-+-+-+" >>1mK-+R+-+-! >>xabcdefghy >> >>The above position (white to move) occurred in an actual game WT vs. GM Nick >>Defirmian. >>As a human player , my evaluation based on whites king locked and poor pawn >>structure should be at least -400 points. A mate in about 50 moves can be >>predicted with a forced rook exchange and winning a pawn with zugzwang. These >>can be accomplished by marching the black king to the second and rook on the >>first and than get the king to h5, forcing whites bishop off g5 with zugzwang. >>Since the kings mobility strength is equal to at least one rook,the bishops of >>opposite colore rule does not apply here. >>My question to programmers is: ? Are programs being blindfolded by BOC and >>Kingsafety rules?? >>In my opinion,a locked king should result in a loss of -400 evaluation points >>until an escape is found. >> >> >>NDF - WT [B80] >> >>1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 a6 6.Be3 e6 7.f3 b5 8.Qd2 Nbd7 >>9.0-0-0 Bb7 10.g4 Nb6 11.g5 Nfd7 12.Bd3 Rc8 13.Kb1 Ne5 14.Qe1 b4 15.Nce2 d5 >>16.h4 Nxd3 17.cxd3 e5 18.Nf5 d4 19.Bg1 Na4 20.Rh2 g6 21.Qg3 Qc7 22.Rc1 Nc5 >>23.Nh6 Bxh6 24.gxh6 0-0 25.f4 Qa5 26.fxe5 b3 27.a3 Qd2 28.Ka1 Qxd3 29.Qxd3 Nxd3 >>30.Rf1 Bxe4 31.Nxd4 Bd5 32.Re2 Bc4 33.Rd1 Rfe8 34.Nf3 Nb4 35.Red2 Nc2+ 36.Kb1 >>Be6 37.Nd4 Nxd4 38.Bxd4 Bf5+ 39.Ka1 Rcd8 40.Bf2 Rxd2 41.Rxd2 f6 42.exf6 Kf7 >>43.Rd1 Kxf6 44.Bd4+ Kf7(above position) >> >>PS,all currently top rated programs are useless and or missleading for >>use of analysing such positions. Is it time to add or modify rules for >>BOC and Kingsafety? > > >Such positions are in a class of positions that are easy for humans to recognize >and deal with, but very difficult for computers to understand. The reason that >"never" and "only beyond my horizon" are _identical_ so far as the computer is >concerned... > >Most of us try to tackle this problem by recognizing the problem earlier than >this to prevent it from happening... IE the pawn at g6 in this case is the >killer with the bishop controlling f8 so that the king can't ever get out >unless the bishop is driven off the diagonal or captured. thank you for your reply. If Nick used a computer program like fritz and or shredder for this game he surely will be disapointed with their performance. In this game we prooved that the use of computers for correspondence games could be actually miss-guide its operator. It is difficult for me to understand why programs are seeking to exchange the rook,as if they have instructions to play for a draw with the BOC rule. But in this case just simple looses. And also,why is their no evaluation reduction for king-mobility loss,which in this position should be equevalent to a rook.
This page took 0 seconds to execute
Last modified: Thu, 15 Apr 21 08:11:13 -0700
Current Computer Chess Club Forums at Talkchess. This site by Sean Mintz.