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Subject: Re: Why I Can't Bring Myself To Watch Kramnik v Fritz Tomorrow

Author: Roy Eassa

Date: 08:06:16 10/09/02

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On October 09, 2002 at 11:00:39, Thorsten Czub wrote:

>i think your conclusion is wrong.
>your mistake is that you don't ask yourself WHY fritz leads the ssdf-list.
>Fritz is NOT leading it, because it knows much about chess.
>
>And it is not WINNING against humans (low ELO) because it knows much about
>chess, but because it searches that deep.
>
>WE judge that Fritz is the strongest, or stronger than others,
>because we see the ssdf-results.
>
>and we believe that a chess programm beating all others is also the strongest.
>IMO this is a senseless measuring.
>
>Because in the case of the match between kramnik and fritz, the lack of fritz
>knowledge is confronted with the big chess-knowledge of kramnik.
>
>its clear that when kramnik can direct the game this way the search depth
>of fritz has nothing to do, it can break through with his superior knowledge.
>
>IMO other chess programs like Rebel, Hiarcs8, Shredder, even oldie Mchess or
>others would have played different and better.
>
>
>A human player is always impressed when a computer is good in the field
>he himself thinks he is very good.
>
>so for a chessplayer good in tactics, one should choose a chess program
>that is good in tactics too. this will impress the human beeing and make
>him problems.
>
>for a chessplayer good in positional, one must choose a chess program that
>plays good in positional.
>
>We make the mistake to believe that the ssdf delivers us with ABSOLUTE results.
>The mistake is to believe that the ELO and the performance fritz gets against
>computer-programs is 100% the same as the ELO of Kramnik.
>
>But this is not the case.
>
>strength is not strength.
>
>Elo number is not = Elo number.
>
>Although shredder and hiarcs8 and others might lose against Fritz in a match
>on our autoplayers, they must not be weaker against kramnik than fritz is.
>
>Because their strength is in the same area than kramniks strength is.
>while  fritz has a lack here.
>
>of course shredder and hiarcs do not know as much about positional and chess
>than kramnik does, but they run on a fast hardware.
>
>and would reach IMO a better result than fritz does.
>
>if you have a sports car, that is made for fast speed on the motorway,
>you don't drive with it where no roads are, in the forrest or on the beach.
>
>if you drive a jeep, you will be better than the sports car on the beach and
>where no roads are and in the forrest, but the sports car will be better
>on the motorway.
>
>now WHO is better ?? sports car or jeep ?
>
>You cannot say this.
>
>the sports car drives faster, it is fritz.
>but the jeep has bigger tires, it has 4-wheels-drive and
>is better in the forrest when it is very muddy.
>
>
>the same is with chess programs.
>
>ssdf measures the motorway strength. there a sports car like fritz
>(slim core, less knowledge = small weight of a sports car, much PS)
>wins.
>
>but drive with it into a muddy forret with trees lying in front of you
>and the sports car has no chance.
>
>
>Maybe you get the point.
>don't be too much disapointed. computerchess is not dying.
>its only that chessbase chose the wrong program.


The only problem with all that is this:  those other programs may be 20% better
or even 50% better positionally than Fritz, while Kramnik is 10000% better
positionally.  Switching programs wouldn't make a significant difference in the
face of such a chasm.



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