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Subject: Re: Q&A with Feng-Hsiung Hsu

Author: Vincent Diepeveen

Date: 03:08:44 10/14/02

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On October 14, 2002 at 05:13:03, Andreas Guettinger wrote:

>On October 13, 2002 at 15:35:12, Vincent Diepeveen wrote:
>
>>On October 13, 2002 at 14:40:12, James Swafford wrote:
>>
>>I wonder why. there is just one person ever in this whole
>>planet who said 12(6) = 18 ply, and that's robert hyatt.
>>
>>there is 4 the same statements from hsu.
>>  a) page 5 at his paper.
>>  b) 3 in this talk
>>
>>there is many statements from hyatt in 98 and 99 that it was
>>getting 12 ply, when in 99 at world champs many got 12 ply it was
>>18 ply suddenly...
>>
>>But the clearest statement is next:
>>
>>EeEk(* DM) kibitzes: kib question from ardee: Does "12(6)" mean 12 total ply or
>>12+6=18 total ply?  This has the been source of huge arguments for years!
>>
>>directly the answer came a few seconds later:
>>
>>CrazyBird(DM) kibitzes: 12 total in terms of brute force. 6 is just the max
>>partition in hardware.
>>
>>
>
>Utter nonsense. What would be sense of a million dollar hardware that is
>restricted for ply 1 to 6? Even my Super Forte on a 5Mhz 65xx got 6 ply Brute
>Force in 1987. 480 processors that fight for 48000 positions?
>
>12 ply software, then harware kicks in. 12 ply + 6 ply means a search depth <=
>18 ply.
>
>Andreas

Please listen carefully. He said it is 12 ply. It was 12 ply.

NO ONE got 12 ply in 1997 with such a program.

Schach 3.0 if you give it billions of nodes for a search
doesn't get further than 12 ply *ever*. And this is a
very simple program in assembly, WITH nullmove.

Do you get the point?

That we today have such improved engines which take better advantage of
RAM and have a better branching factor, you cannot compare that with 1997
deep blue.

Because deep blue didn't use nullmove for example.

With nullmove Fritz has a branching factor defined by:
  2.8^depth * c

Deep Blue has more like
  4.5^depth * e

where the 'e' from deep blue is MUCH bigger than c from fritz.

So please do not compare it.

everyone with a calculator knows that 2.8 to the power depth is going to
be way way less than 4.5 to the power depth.

Do you?




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