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Subject: Re: Intel doesn't garantuee P4 has hyperthreading in the CPU

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 10:25:41 11/18/02

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On November 18, 2002 at 11:01:05, Vincent Diepeveen wrote:

>On November 18, 2002 at 10:58:35, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>
>>On November 18, 2002 at 10:15:53, Vincent Diepeveen wrote:
>>
>>>On November 18, 2002 at 01:28:17, Terry McCracken wrote:
>>>
>>>>On November 17, 2002 at 13:58:43, Vincent Diepeveen wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Hello,
>>>>>
>>>>>If i read the below section of the intel programming guide very well,
>>>>>then i interpret that as:
>>>>>
>>>>>  a) only the Xeon MP has hyperthreading and not the normal P4s,
>>>>>     not even P4s sold as Northwoods.
>>>>>
>>>>>  b) even the Xeon MP you should not assume that it supports hyper
>>>>>     threading. In fact something that gets sold as Xeon MP you should
>>>>>     still not assume that it supports hyper threading, but instead
>>>>>     one must assume that only after specifically questionning the cpu
>>>>>     whether it can do it.
>>>>>
>>>>>Intel IA-32 programming manual. Page 247 (of 780):
>>>>>"
>>>>>7.6.1 Implementation of Hyper-Threading Technology in IA-32 Processors
>>>>>
>>>>>Intel's Hyper-threading Technology was introduced into the IA-32 architecture
>>>>>in the Intel Xeon processor MP and in the later steppings of the Intel Xeon
>>>>>processor. Both of these processors implement Hyper-Threading Technology with 2
>>>>>logical processors per physical processor. When reading the following sections
>>>>>(and other sections in this book that refer to this technology), assume that all
>>>>>references to the implementation of Hyper-Threading Technology in the Intel Xeon
>>>>>processor MP also apply to those later steppings of the Intel Xeon processor
>>>>>that implement Hyper-Threading Technology.
>>>>>
>>>>>Intel recommends that software not rely on IA-32 processor names to determine
>>>>>whether a processor supports Hyper-Threading Technology; but instead, it should
>>>>>use the CPUID instruction as described in Section 7.6.5, "Detecting
>>>>>Hyper-Threading Technology".
>>>>>"
>>>>>
>>>>>Vincent
>>>>
>>>>Careful, Intel sues!
>>>
>>>Not at all. They now claim only the > 3Ghz P4s will have hyperthreading
>>>enabled, but that's an easy claim, because i cannot check it as the
>>>fastest P4 i can test now is 2.53Ghz. With some luck soon also 2.8Ghz P4.
>>>
>>>At the time the > 3 Ghz P4s are there within say a 6 months or so,
>>>of course those statements will have been forgotten.
>>>
>>>The only official statement is that the group of processors which
>>>*might* support SMT is the Xeon MPs and only
>>>after you ask the cpu a CPUID and when that response is positive
>>>*then* it supports it.
>>>
>>>So they give ZERO garantuee simply yet.
>>>
>>>Best regards,
>>>Vincent
>>
>>
>>It isn't only the xeon MT.  The MTs are certified for 4-way and 8-way, but the
>>other xeons are also doing hyperthreading.  The 2.8's in particular.  This is
>>from experience, not from guessing, btw...
>
>Not a single P4 i tested so far with the 'smt' turned on is doing it Bob,
>of course i do not do a CPUID in DIEP to check whether the chip is supporting
>it.
>
>The statement from intel is very clear. *nowhere* they garantuee it works
>and at the Xeon MP it might work after you do a CPUID.
>
>The results posted by Nalimov here are all from dual Xeon MPs.
>
>Best regards,
>Vincent


There are three kinds of intel processors.

PIV

PIV xeon

xeon MP

the last two definitely have hyper-threading.  I have two here (not MPs as I
don't have any
quads at the faster clock rates yet).

I'm talking about the xeon, not the xeon MP.  And they definitely have
hyper-threading
support...

And I don't think Eugene's machines were xeon MPs...  the MPs are pricier and
really
intended for 4-way and 8-way machines...  The duals I have here are _not_ MP
processors.



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