Author: Bruce Moreland
Date: 13:17:19 12/19/02
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On December 19, 2002 at 08:31:13, Rolf Tueschen wrote: >On December 18, 2002 at 23:04:36, Bruce Moreland wrote: > >>On December 18, 2002 at 21:35:27, Rolf Tueschen wrote: >> >>>Thanks. Now you give the two exceptions as if you could forget them. But exactly >>>the LONGER plans are characteristic for good GM, so, how about a rethink of the >>>whole trick? - Would you try to hold it up or is it just one of these tricks to >>>let LOOK a prog quite good while it has still the known weaknesses? >> >>In this case a "long" plan could be white pawns f2, g3, h2, white king g1, black >>pawn f3, black plays Qh3 while down a rook. >> >>Normally it takes three plies to see this: Qh3, any, Qg2#. Three plies doesn't >>seem like a lot, but when you do null move pruning with depth reduction of two >>plies, you will have to enter this node with a six-ply search in order to see >>this. Without null move, you need four plies to see this is threatened (your >>own move, plus three plies to kill you). >> >>This seems incredibly stupid, but in practice, adding null-move forward pruning >>is like giving the program two swords and a heavy dose of amphetimines. The >>difference is amazing. > > >Ok, I don't follow your logic. And I'm just an average chess player. Look, I was >speaking of positional positions, right? There is no tactics with sudden mates. >I would even define positional positions as positions without realistic threats, >but maybe with nullmove winners in two or in three. But it's completely nonsense >to see all this because the position as such has NOTHING tactical. (And GM KNOW >what to do in such positions!) So, yes, my argument is mainly based on >positional chess. And that is exactly the basic weakness of all computer chess. >With this Subject I try to argue against such dreaming (as in M. Feist's >interview). > >Rolf Tueschen Null-move forward pruning is about speeding up bread-and-butter tactics. The program will see a few things less clearly, but it will see many other things more clearly. It's a significant strength increase in practical play. bruce
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