Author: Marc van Hal
Date: 11:09:28 12/31/02
Go up one level in this thread
On December 31, 2002 at 10:34:50, Ed Schröder wrote: >On December 31, 2002 at 09:34:07, Martin Giepmans wrote: > >>On December 31, 2002 at 06:55:09, David Rasmussen wrote: >> >>>On December 30, 2002 at 03:17:38, Martin Giepmans wrote: >>> >>>>Yesterday, when I woke up from my (off line) Christmas sleep >>>>and logged on to CCC, the news was everywhere: >>>> >>>> *** Ed reveals his secrets! *** >>>> >>>>Astonishing! >>>> >>>>Basically I agree with what others have said about it. >>>>It is a very nice thing to do, a wonderful Christmas present. >>>> >>>>But there are also other feelings. >>>>Imagine a programmer who has worked for years to improve his >>>>engine. He has discovered many ideas that Ed also discovered, >>>>or similar ones. These ideas gave his engine an edge and >>>>of course he has never revealed them to anyone. >>>> >>>>Then, one day he logges on to CCC and ... >>>>How would this programmer feel? >>>>Not too happy, I guess! >>>> >>> >>>So what? >>> >>>The way I see it, there is no reason that a horde of talented amateurs are >>>spending 10 years to come up with the same things as Ed and others have. You >>>don't have to be able to come up with the same things in the same time to be >>>talented. And you certainly don't have to be able to come up with the same >>>things in much shorter time to be talented. Revealing his secrets will give the >>>amateur field a good kick forward so all are up to appx. the same level. Chess >>>programmming techniques are being kept secret the way they are because of the >>>petty money involved. If it was scientifically important (and it might be) to >>>make good chess programs, all techniques would be publicized and the entire >>>field would benefit from this, and even stronger programs would result overall, >>>in the same timeframe. As it is now, a few people hold the lead, for no other >>>reason than money. That's fine by me, it's just not what's best for the field. >>>The idea that holdning back information causes competition is ridiculous. It >>>just narrows the people thinking on the edge of technology to a very little >>>crowd. > >>I agree. Money was and is the main obstacle. > >Money certainly is, there is another main reason too, competition. It makes >little sense to compete while giving away your idea's. > >Ed > > > >>I'm not sure, though, if holding back information and ideas is always a bad >>thing. One advantage is that it forces those who don't have access to all that >>is known to think for themselves. >>When you use your own mind you might just reinvent the wheel, but you >>might also find new and better approaches. >>And even if you just reinvent the wheel, there is still the joy of discovery! >> >>To me sharing is OK and secrets are also OK. I think there should be >>some kind of balance between these two. Too much sharing promotes laziness. >>On the other hand, if there are to many secrets, if there is a lack of >>communication, our minds start to run in circles. >>We are after all social beings. We _need_ communication. >> >>>Ed is my hero :) >> >>Mine too. I think he deserves a Turing prize! >> >>Martin >> >>> >>>/David When I would start chess programing i would turn everything upside down Even when I had all the known how of other programs. Maybe it would be intresting to write the storys for novice programmers. I am sure you will learn from this. And you will enjoy it more to write it down in that way. (So starting from the start and make a fast route to make a chess program then start to explain what are the tecniques options and how to use them. And what they do) (You only have to be very honest about it things wich did not work for you Might have worked with a slightly diferent aproge Only be positive or negative about something when you 100% sure Also write up the mistakes you made in the past and how you solved them. Or how you recognized that it was that particular part you did do wrong. This wil encourage the reading chess programmer when he messed it up again. ) And ofcourse it would be a great help for all chess programers meaning the curent and the chess programmers of the future. Marc
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