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Subject: Re: Shredder 7 didnt find it at depth 17/50

Author: Christopher A. Morgan

Date: 14:24:02 01/02/03

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For Fritz 8, version 8.0.0.8, on Athlon 750, 96MB hash, after 35 minutes 5
seconds F8 found Qxg6 with depth of 15/45, after switching from h5 which it held
from the beginning.  It’s now 2hrs and 52 minutes and no mate found.  No change
in analysis after 2 hours and 2 minutes with depth of 17/51.


New game
1r4r1/3q1npk/2b1pbnp/Rp1p4/1N1P3P/2PQ1pP1/1K3B2/5B1R w - - 0 1

Analysis by Fritz 8:

1.h5 Ng5 2.hxg6+ Kh8 3.Qe3 Ra8 4.Nxc6 Qxc6 5.Bxb5
  -+  (-1.62)   Depth: 7/23   00:00:00  116kN
1.h5 Nfh8 2.Qxf3 Rgf8 3.hxg6+ Nxg6 4.Qg4 Ra8 5.Rxa8
  -+  (-1.84)   Depth: 8/25   00:00:01  377kN
1.h5 Nfh8 2.Qxf3 Ne7 3.Bd3+ g6 4.Qxf6 Rgf8 5.hxg6+ Nhxg6 6.Qg5
  -+  (-1.69)   Depth: 9/33   00:00:03  906kN
1.h5 Nfh8 2.hxg6+ Nxg6 3.Qxf3 e5 4.Bh3 Qb7 5.Ra6 e4
  -+  (-1.50)   Depth: 10/30   00:00:06  1628kN
1.h5 Nd6 2.Qxg6+ Kh8 3.Bd3 Ne4 4.Be3 Rgc8 5.Bxh6 Qc7 6.Bxe4 dxe4 7.Nxc6 Qxc6
8.Bd2
  -+  (-1.62)   Depth: 11/35   00:00:29  9443kN
1.h5 Nd6 2.Qxg6+ Kh8 3.Bd3 Ne4 4.Rha1 Rgc8 5.Be3 Bb7 6.Bxe4 dxe4 7.Ra7 Ra8 8.g4
  -+  (-1.69)   Depth: 12/36   00:01:11  23334kN
1.h5 Nd6 2.Qxg6+ Kh8 3.Bd3 Ne4 4.Be3 Bb7 5.Rxb5 Rgc8 6.Bf4 Ra8 7.Rf1 Kg8 8.Rxf3
Rxc3
  -+  (-1.69)   Depth: 13/38   00:03:18  67369kN
1.h5 Nd6 2.hxg6+ Kh8 3.Qe3 Rgc8 4.Qxf3 Rf8
  -+  (-1.69)   Depth: 14/43   00:09:26  200375kN
1.h5 Nd6 2.hxg6+ Kh8 3.Qe3 Rgc8 4.Bd3 Bd8 5.Raa1 Nc4+ 6.Bxc4 bxc4 7.Qxf3
  -+  (-1.78)   Depth: 15/43   00:24:47  543201kN
1.Qxg6+!
  -+  (-1.75)   Depth: 15/45   00:35:05  773347kN
1.Qxg6+!
  -+  (-1.59)   Depth: 15/45   00:36:17  798997kN
1.Qxg6+!
  ì  (-1.28)   Depth: 15/45   00:37:11  818224kN
1.Qxg6+!
  3  (-0.66)   Depth: 15/45   00:38:55  855035kN
1.Qxg6+ Kxg6 2.Bd3+ Kh5 3.g4+ Kxg4 4.Rg1+ Kh3 5.Bf1+ Kh2 6.Bg3+ Kxg1 7.Ra1 Ra8
8.Rd1 Ra1
  +-  (1.59)   Depth: 15/51   00:49:54  1087413kN
1.Qxg6+ Kxg6 2.Bd3+ Kh5 3.g4+ Kxg4 4.Rg1+ Kh3 5.Bf1+ Kh2 6.Bg3+ Kxg1 7.Ra1 Ra8
8.Rd1 Ra1 9.Rxa1 Qa7
  +-  (1.59)   Depth: 16/47   00:57:41  1258151kN
1.Qxg6+!
  +-  (1.88)   Depth: 17/51   01:32:45  2023703kN
1.Qxg6+!
  +-  (2.16)   Depth: 17/51   02:02:08  2657933kN


On January 02, 2003 at 15:53:44, Drexel,Michael wrote:

>On January 02, 2003 at 14:34:13, Dieter Buerssner wrote:
>
>>On January 02, 2003 at 14:03:42, Manfred Rosenboom wrote:
>>
>>>Yace needs a while, but from depth 11 on it finds the move.
>>>Also in depth 13 Yace announce a mate in 16. This announcement may be wrong, but
>>>at least there must be a mate.
>>
>>Manfred, I think with most chess engines (not mate solvers) mate announcements
>>must be interpreted as: It is at least a mate that long, it may be faster. In
>>this sense, announcing mate in 16 is not wrong. BTW. Here my current version
>>announces mate in 15. But this can also be pure luck, and with a different hash
>>table size, it might first find mate in 16, too.
>>
>>IIRC, the position was discussed here not too long ago.
>>
>>Regards,
>>Dieter
>
>Hello Dieter,
>
>Shredder 7 is not able to find the mate at depth 17/50 1026360kN
>PV: -+(-3.12) 1.h5 Kh8 2.hxg6 Sg5 3.Le3 Tgf8 4.Ta7 Dxa7 5.Sxc6 Da8 6.Sxb8 Dxb8
>7.Lf4 Da7
>at this depth shredder 7 evaluates 1.h5 (1/44) for minutes and 1.Qxg6+ (3/44)
>for roughly two seconds.
>at which depth do you think it would find the mate? 30/30?
>this 'behaviour' has obviously something to do with its superior playing
>strength.



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