Author: Drexel,Michael
Date: 06:32:53 01/13/03
Go up one level in this thread
On January 13, 2003 at 08:17:54, Mike Hood wrote: >On January 13, 2003 at 07:47:05, Mike Hood wrote: > >>On January 13, 2003 at 00:27:28, Drexel,Michael wrote: >> >>>On January 12, 2003 at 21:18:25, Mike Hood wrote: >>> >>>>A question out of morbid curiosity: what's the highest incorrect score that >>>>anyone has seen a top chess program award? ie, what's the highest winning score >>>>that a chess program gives itself, blind to the fact that it must unavoidably >>>>lose? >>>> >>>>The highest score I have seen is Fritz 8 in the recently posted "Georgian >>>>Peasant" game. >>>> >>>>[D] 8/3P3k/n2K3p/2p3n1/1b4N1/2p1p1P1/8/3B4 w >>>> >>>>1. Nf6+ Kg7 2. Nh5+ Kg6 3. Bc2+ Kxh5 4. d8=Q Nf7+ 5. Ke6 Nxd8+ 6. Kf5 e2 7. Be4 >>>>e1=N 8. Bd5 c2 9. Bc4 c1=N 10. Bb5 Nc6 11. Bxc6 Nc7 12. Ba4 Nc2 13. Bxc2 Ne2 >>>>14. Bd1 Nd5 15. Bxe2# 1-0 >>>> >>>>After 3. Bc2+, Fritz 8's winning score for Black soars ever higher: >>>> >>>>Analysis by Fritz 8: >>>> >>>>3...Kxh5 4.Bd1+ Kg6 5.Kc6 Nb8+ 6.Kd6 Nxd7 7.Kxd7 Kf5 >>>> -+ (-7.56) Depth: 7/21 00:00:00 71kN >>>>3...Kxh5! >>>> -+ (-7.84) Depth: 8/27 00:00:00 182kN >>>>3...Kxh5! >>>> -+ (-8.13) Depth: 9/30 00:00:01 470kN >>>>3...Kxh5-- >>>> -+ (-7.84) Depth: 10/23 00:00:01 489kN >>>>3...Kxh5 4.Bd1+ Kg6 >>>> -+ (-7.84) Depth: 10/29 00:00:01 678kN >>>>3...Kxh5! >>>> -+ (-8.13) Depth: 11/29 00:00:03 1375kN >>>>3...Kxh5! >>>> -+ (-8.41) Depth: 12/35 00:00:08 3525kN >>>>3...Kxh5! >>>> -+ (-8.69) Depth: 13/38 00:00:22 9391kN >>>>3...Kxh5! >>>> -+ (-8.97) Depth: 13/40 00:00:34 14045kN >>>>3...Kxh5 4.Bd1+ Kg6 5.Kd5 Nf7 6.Kc4 Ne5+ 7.Kb3 Nxd7 8.Be2 Nc7 9.Kc2 Kf6 >>>> -+ (-9.16) Depth: 13/40 00:00:45 18913kN >>>>3...Kxh5 4.Bd1+ Kg6 5.Kd5 Nf7 6.Kc4 Ne5+ 7.Kb3 Nxd7 8.Kc2 Ne5 9.Be2 Nc7 10.Kd1 >>>>Kf5 11.Kc2 >>>> -+ (-9.34) Depth: 14/40 00:01:27 34783kN >>>>3...Kxh5! >>>> -+ (-9.63) Depth: 15/44 00:03:03 72060kN >>>>3...Kxh5 4.Bd1+ Kg6 5.Kd5 Nf7 6.Kc4 Ne5+ 7.Kb3 Nxd7 8.Kc2 Ne5 9.Be2 c4 10.Bf1 >>>>Nc5 11.Be2 Nd3 >>>> -+ (-9.78) Depth: 16/46 00:06:14 149982kN >>>>3...Kxh5! >>>> -+ (-10.06) Depth: 17/47 00:15:11 372788kN >>>> >>>>It's not a matter of Fritz choosing the wrong move for Black. Kxh5 is correct, >>>>but Fritz doesn't expect White to play d8Q! >>>> >>>>I'm not just knocking Fritz. None of the chess programs in my possession do any >>>>better. I even tried setting Fritz's selectivity parameter to zero, to prevent >>>>null move generation, but found no improvement. So, does anyone have any other >>>>position that the current top programs totally misjudge? >>> >>>[D] kbn1nBRQ/4P1PQ/4P1PQ/6PB/6P1/8/8/7K w - - 0 6 >>> >>>Analysis by Fritz 8: >>> >>>6.Kg1 Ba7+ 7.Kh2 Nb6 8.Kh1 Nc4 9.Kg2 Ne3+ 10.Kh1 >>> +- (34.22) Depth: 7/15 00:00:00 3kN >>>6.Kg1 Ba7+ 7.Kh2 Nb6 8.Kg2 Nd5 9.Kg3 Ndc7 10.Kh2 Nxe6 >>> +- (34.06) Depth: 8/17 00:00:00 6kN >>>6.Kg1 Ba7+ 7.Kh2 Nb6 8.Kg2 Nd5 9.Kh1 Bb8 >>> +- (33.88) Depth: 9/19 00:00:00 13kN >>>6.Kg1 Ba7+ 7.Kh2 Nb6 8.Kg2 Nd5 9.Kh1 >>> +- (33.88) Depth: 10/22 00:00:00 24kN >>>6.Kg1-- >>> +- (33.31) Depth: 11/11 00:00:00 24kN >>>6.Kg1 Ba7+ 7.Kh2 >>> +- (33.31) Depth: 11/18 00:00:00 56kN >>>6.Kg2! >>> +- (33.34) Depth: 11/18 00:00:00 75kN >>>6.Kg2 Nb6 7.Kf3 Nd5 8.Ke2 Nf4+ 9.Kf2 Ba7+ 10.Kf3 Bb8 11.Ke4 >>> +- (33.25) Depth: 12/26 00:00:00 213kN >>>6.Kg2 Nb6 7.Kf3 Nd5 8.Ke2 Bf4 9.Kf2 Kb7 10.Kf1 Kb8 11.Kf2 Ndf6 12.gxf6 >>> +- (33.13) Depth: 13/28 00:00:00 410kN >>>6.Kg2 Nb6 7.Kf3 Nd5 8.Ke2 Bf4 9.Kf2 Kb8 10.Kg2 Ka8 11.Kf1 Ndf6 12.gxf6 >>> +- (32.97) Depth: 14/29 00:00:00 612kN >>>6.Kg2 Nb6 7.Kf3 Nd5 8.Ke2 Bf4 9.Kf2 Kb8 10.Kf3 Kc8 11.Ke2 Kb8 >>> +- (32.84) Depth: 15/30 00:00:01 1041kN >>>6.Kg2-- >>> +- (32.56) Depth: 16/30 00:00:01 1412kN >>>6.Kg2 Nb6 7.Kf3 Nd5 >>> +- (32.56) Depth: 16/30 00:00:02 1653kN >>>6.Kg2-- >>> +- (32.28) Depth: 17/32 00:00:02 2074kN >>>6.Kg2 Nb6 7.Kf3 Nd5 >>> +- (32.28) Depth: 17/32 00:00:03 2966kN >>>6.Kg2-- >>> +- (32.00) Depth: 18/32 00:00:04 3308kN >>>6.Kg2 Bf4 7.Kf3 Bc1 8.Kg3 Ncd6 9.Kf2 Ne4+ 10.Kf3 Nc5 11.Kg3 Nxe6 12.Kh2 Bxg5 >>>13.Kg2 Nf4+ 14.Kh1 Bxh6 >>> +- (28.53) Depth: 18/50 00:00:12 10755kN >>>6.Kg2 Bf4 7.Kf3 Bc1 8.Kg3 Ncd6 9.Kf2 Ne4+ 10.Kf3 Nc5 11.Kg3 Nxe6 12.Kh2 Bxg5 >>>13.Kg2 Nf4+ 14.Kh1 Bxh6 >>> +- (28.53) Depth: 19/36 00:00:15 13607kN >>>6.Kg2 Bf4 7.Kf3 Bc1 8.Kg3 Ncd6 9.Kf2 Ne4+ 10.Kf3 Nc5 11.Kg3 Nxe6 12.Kh2 Bxg5 >>>13.Kg2 Kb7 14.Qxg5 Nxg5 15.Qh6 Ne4 >>> +- (28.53) Depth: 20/36 00:00:20 18279kN >>>6.Kg2 Bf4 7.Kf3 Bc1 8.Kg3 Ncd6 9.Kf2 Ne4+ 10.Kf3 Nc5 11.Kg3 Nxe6 12.Kh2 Bf4+ >>>13.Kg1 Nxg5 14.Kg2 Ka7 15.Kh1 Nh3 >>> +- (28.38) Depth: 21/42 00:00:34 30397kN >>>6.Kg2 Bf4 7.Kf3 Bc1 8.Kg3 Ncd6 9.Kf2 Ne4+ 10.Kf3 Nc5 11.Kg3 Nxe6 12.Kh2 Bf4+ >>>13.Kg1 Nxg5 14.Kg2 Ka7 15.Kh1 Ne6 >>> +- (28.38) Depth: 22/44 00:00:51 46491kN >>>6.Kg2 Bf4 7.Kf3 Bc1 8.Kg3 Ncd6 9.Kf2 Ne4+ 10.Kf3 Nc5 11.Kg3 Nxe6 12.Kh2 Bf4+ >>>13.Kg1 Nxg5 14.Kg2 Ka7 15.Kh1 Ne6 >>> +- (28.38) Depth: 23/46 00:01:22 78628kN >>>6.Kg2 Bf4 7.Kf3 Bc1 8.Kg3 Ncd6 9.Kf2 Ne4+ 10.Kf3 Nc5 11.Kg3 Nxe6 12.Kh2 Bf4+ >>>13.Kg1 Nxg5 14.Kg2 Ka7 15.Kh1 Ka8 >>> +- (28.38) Depth: 24/47 00:02:31 147989kN >> >>Thanks, Michael, although judging by the line Fritz is expecting, it could be a >>matter of horizon effect that will be solved by a deep enough search. I suspect >>that if I let Fritz run for a few hours the evaluation will slowly get smaller. >>I "only" have a Pentium 3-733, but I'll let it run until this evening. > >After the first 45 minutes... Fritz's evaluation has dropped slightly, but >unfortunately his highest priority is capturing the pawn on e6. This takes him 7 >moves. Let's see if he gets round to a sensible attack when this totally >superfluous manoeuvre is over..... Yes, to place this pawn on e6 was really mean. Shredder has much better code regarding immobility of pieces: Analysis by Shredder 7: 1.Kg2 +- (35.97) Depth: 1/1 00:00:00 1.Kg2 Lf4 +- (36.32) Depth: 2/3 00:00:00 1.Kg2 Lf4 +- (36.32) Depth: 2/3 00:00:00 1.Kg2 Lf4 2.Kf2 +- (36.14) Depth: 3/5 00:00:00 1.Kg2 Lf4 2.Kg1 Lb8 +- (28.78) Depth: 4/5 00:00:00 1.Kg2 Lf4 2.Kg1 Lb8 +- (28.78) Depth: 4/5 00:00:00 1.Kg2 Lf4 2.Kg1 Sf6 3.gxf6 +- (29.03) Depth: 5/6 00:00:00 1.Kg2 Lf4 2.Kf2 Sf6 3.gxf6 +- (29.53) Depth: 5/7 00:00:00 1.Kg2 Lf4 2.Kf2 Lxg5 3.Dxg5 +- (30.37) Depth: 5/7 00:00:00 1.Kg2 Le5 2.Kg1 Lf4 3.Kg2 +- (30.12) Depth: 6/9 00:00:00 1.Kg2 Le5 2.Kf2 Lf4 3.Ke2 Lb8 +- (29.39) Depth: 6/9 00:00:00 1.Kg2 Lc7 2.Kf3 Le5 3.Ke4 Sf6+ 4.Kxe5 +- (23.13) Depth: 6/9 00:00:00 1.Kg2 Lc7 2.Kf3 Le5 3.Ke4 Sf6+ 4.Kxe5 Sxg4+ 5.Lxg4 +- (23.38) Depth: 7/9 00:00:00 9kN 1.Kg2 Lc7 2.Kf3 Ka7 3.Ke4 Lh2 +- (23.87) Depth: 7/17 00:00:00 16kN 1.Kg2 Kb7 2.Kf1 Sa7 3.Ke2 Sf6 4.gxf6 +- (24.10) Depth: 8/20 00:00:00 52kN 1.Kg2 Ka7 2.Kf2 Lh2 3.Ke1 Lg3+ 4.Kd1 Lh2 5.Kd2 Lf4+ 6.Kd1 Lh2 7.Kd2 Lf4+ 8.Kd1 Lh2 9.Kd2 +- (23.86) Depth: 9/24 00:00:00 120kN 1.Kg2 Ka7 2.Kf2 Lf4 3.Ke2 Sc7 4.e8D Lxg5 5.Dxc8 Sxe6 6.Dxe6 +- (23.85) Depth: 10/23 00:00:00 215kN 1.Kg2 Lc7 2.Kf3 Kb7 3.Ke4 Lb6 4.Kd3 Ka8 5.Kc3 La5+ 6.Kb2 Lc7 7.Kc1 Lb6 8.Kc2 +- (23.60) Depth: 11/25 00:00:01 349kN 1.Kg2 Lc7 2.Kf3 Lb6 3.Ke4 Scd6+ 4.Kd3 Lf2 5.Kc3 Le3 6.Kc2 Ld4 7.Kd1 La7 8.Ke1 Kb7 +- (23.10) Depth: 11/25 00:00:01 446kN 1.Kg2 Lc7 2.Kf3 Lb6 3.Ke4 Scd6+ 4.Kf4 Kb7 5.Kf3 Ka8 6.Kg2 Sc8 7.Kh1 Lc7 8.Kg2 +- (18.24) Depth: 11/25 00:00:01 551kN 1.Kg2 Lc7 2.Kf3 Lb6 3.Ke4 Scd6+ 4.Kf4 Ka7 5.Kf3 Sxg7 6.D7xg7 Ka8 7.Ke2 Sc8 8.e8D Ld8 9.Dxd8 +- (18.23) Depth: 12/25 00:00:02 617kN 1.Kg2 Lc7 2.Kf3 Lb6 3.Ke4 Scd6+ 4.Kf4 Ka7 5.Kf3 Ka8 6.Kg3 Ka7 7.Kh3 Kb7 8.Kh2 Sc8 9.Kh1 La5 10.Kg2 Ka8 +- (18.24) Depth: 13/25 00:00:02 694kN 1.Kg2 Lc7 2.Kf2 Lb6+ 3.Ke1 Scd6 4.Ke2 Kb7 5.Kf1 Ka8 6.Ke2 Kb7 7.Kf1 Ka8 8.Ke2 Kb7 +- (18.04) Depth: 14/27 00:00:02 923kN 1.Kg2 La7 2.Kf1 Scd6 3.Ke1 +- (17.84) Depth: 15/31 00:00:06 2657kN 1.Kg2 Ld6 2.Kf3 Kb8 3.Ke4 Lb4 4.Ke5 Scd6 5.Kd4 +- (17.59) Depth: 16/27 00:00:08 3393kN 1.Kg2 Ld6 2.Kf3 Kb8 3.Ke4 Lb4 4.Ke5 Scd6 5.Kd4 +- (17.09) Depth: 16/27 00:00:08 3430kN 1.Kg2 Ld6 2.Kf3 Lb4 3.Kf2 Sxe7 4.Lxe7 Lxe7 5.Txe8+ Ka7 6.g8D Kb6 7.Txe7 Ka6 8.Ke2 +- (14.31) Depth: 16/29 00:00:11 4988kN 1.Kg2 Ld6 2.Kf3 Lb4 3.Kf2 Scd6 4.Kf1 +- (14.06) Depth: 17/29 00:00:14 6679kN 1.Kg2 Ld6 2.Kf3 Lb4 3.Kf2 Scd6 4.Kf1 Kb8 5.Kg2 Sc8 6.Kh3 +- (13.56) Depth: 17/29 00:00:15 7276kN 1.Kg2 Ld6 2.Kf2 Lb4 3.Kg1 +- (13.30) Depth: 17/30 00:00:21 11770kN 1.Kg2 La7 2.Kf3 Lb6 3.Ke2 Scd6 4.Kd3 Kb8 5.Kc3 Ka8 6.Kc2 La5 7.Kb3 Kb8 8.Ka2 Kb7 9.Kb1 Ka8 10.Kc2 +- (13.05) Depth: 18/41 00:00:36 20621kN 1.Kg2 La7 2.Kf3 Lb6 3.Ke2 Scd6 4.Kd3 Ka7 5.Kc3 La5+ 6.Kb3 Kb6 7.Kc2 Sc4 8.Kd1 Scd6 9.Ke2 Kc5 10.Kd3 Kb6 +- (12.55) Depth: 18/41 00:00:49 27125kN 1.Kg2 La7 2.Kf3 Lb6 3.Ke2 Scd6 4.Kd2 Sxg7 +- (12.55) Depth: 18/42 00:00:58 31207kN 1.Kg1 La7+ 2.Kg2 Scd6 +- (12.56) Depth: 18/42 00:01:00 32025kN 1.Kg1 La7+ 2.Kg2 Scd6 3.Kf3 Lb6 4.Ke2 La5 5.Kd3 Lb6 6.Kd2 Sxg7 +- (12.57) Depth: 18/42 00:01:04 33703kN 1.Kg1 La7+ 2.Kg2 Scd6 3.Kf3 Lb6 4.Ke2 La5 5.Kd3 Ka7 6.Kc2 +- (12.52) Depth: 19/37 00:01:12 37763kN 1.Kg2 La7 +- (12.53) Depth: 19/37 00:01:12 37928kN 1.Kg2 Scd6 2.Kf3 Ka7 3.Ke2 +- (12.53) Depth: 19/37 00:01:17 40199kN 1.Kg2 Scd6 2.Kf3 Ka7 3.Ke2 Sb5 4.Kd3 Lc7 5.Kc4 Sbd6+ 6.Kb4 Kb6 7.Kb3 Ka5 8.Kc3 Sb5+ 9.Kc4 Ld6 10.Kb3 Kb6 11.Kb2 Le5+ 12.Kc2 Lb8 13.Kb3 Ld6 14.Kb2 Le5+ 15.Kc2 +- (12.28) Depth: 20/30 00:01:19 41350kN 1.Kg2 Scd6 2.Kf3 Ka7 3.Ke2 Sb5 4.Kd3 Lc7 5.Kc4 Sbd6+ 6.Kb4 Kb6 7.Kb3 Ka5 8.Kc3 Sb5+ 9.Kb3 +- (11.78) Depth: 20/31 00:01:19 41732kN 1.Kg2 Scd6 2.Kf2 Ka7 3.Ke2 Sb5 4.Kd3 Lc7 5.Kc2 Lb8 6.Kb3 Kb6 7.Kb2 +- (3.31) Depth: 20/41 00:01:46 55970kN 1.Kg2 Ka7 2.Kf3 Scd6 3.Ke2 Sb5 4.Kd3 Lc7 5.Kc4 Kb6 6.Kb3 Lb8 7.Kb2 Kb7 8.Kc1 +- (3.25) Depth: 21/43 00:02:34 81168kN 1.Kg2 Ka7 2.Kf3 Kb6 3.Ke2 Sa7 4.Kd2 Sb5 5.Kc2 Sbd6 6.Kb2 Kc5 7.Kc2 Sc4 8.Kd3 Se5+ 9.Kd2 Sf3+ 10.Kd1 Sd4 11.Ke1 +- (3.00) Depth: 22/41 00:03:25 106511kN 1.Kg2 Ka7 2.Kf3 Kb6 3.Ke2 Sa7 4.Kd2 Sb5 5.Kc2 Kc5 6.Kd3 Sd4 7.Ke3 +- (2.50) Depth: 22/41 00:03:33 111505kN 1.Kg2 Sa7 2.Kf2 Kb7 3.Ke3 Sxg7 4.Lxg7 Sb5 5.e8D Sd6 6.Dxb8+ Kc6 7.Kd3 Sb5 8.Dxb5+ Kxb5 +- (1.89) Depth: 22/41 00:04:32 144505kN 1.Kg2 Ka7 2.Kf3 Kb6 3.Ke3 Scd6 4.Kd3 +- (1.64) Depth: 23/43 00:06:29 221286kN 1.Kg2 Ka7 2.Kf3 Kb6 3.Ke3 Sa7 4.Kd3 Sb5 5.Kc2 ± (1.14) Depth: 23/46 00:12:49 472373kN 1.Kg2 Ka7 2.Kf3 Kb6 3.Ke3 Sa7 4.Kd3 Sb5 5.Ke2 Kc5 6.Kf1 Sd4 7.Kf2 Kb6 ± (1.04) Depth: 23/47 00:21:04 793180kN 1.Kg2 Ka7 2.Kf3 Kb6 3.Ke3 Sa7 4.Kd3 Sb5 5.Ke2 Kb7 ± (0.98) Depth: 24/45 00:24:20 902110kN
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