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Subject: Re: CCT5, was there something missing?

Author: Uri Blass

Date: 13:46:23 01/20/03

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On January 20, 2003 at 16:31:56, Matthew Hull wrote:

>On January 20, 2003 at 16:09:28, Peter Kappler wrote:
>
>>On January 20, 2003 at 15:38:00, Peter Skinner wrote:
>>
>>>With the lack of commercial products participating in the CCT, does it lose some
>>>of the luster in winning it?
>>>
>>>Of course there are always going to be "what ifs" when all participants do not
>>>play. Ferret was allowed to play without kibitzing any information. What would
>>>have happened if Fritz joined and did the same? Would the result have been the
>>>same?
>>>
>>>It seems that there was allowances made for some, and not others. Why was this
>>>the case?
>>>
>>
>>Volker told everyone who wasn't kibitzing on day 1 was told they had to kibitz
>>on day 2, or face disqualification.  To my knowledge, everybody complied,
>>including Ferret.
>>
>>
>>>I am sure if the rule had not been in place, the likes of Shredder, Fritz, and
>>>possibly Junior would have participated.
>>
>>I don't think kibitzing was an issue at all.  It's obvious why Junior didn't
>>particpate - they are busy preparing for their match with Kasparov.
>>
>>Rebel & Tiger have never participated.  Ed has publically stated that he think
>>the potential for cheating is too high.  I think Christophe may share this
>>opinion, but I am not certain.
>>
>>Don't know why Fritz and Shredder weren't there.  Maybe they just weren't
>>interested, but it wouldn't surprise me if the marketing people at Chessbase
>>discouraged them from entering.  Suppose Fritz and Shredder enter, and neither
>>of them wins?  Quite possible, considering the strength of the field, and while
>>none of us would find this result shocking, a casual computer chess fan might
>>suddly wonder why they should spend their money on Fritz & Shredder when there
>>are free amateur programs that are similar in strength.
>>
>>
>>> Chess Tiger already has the ability to
>>>kibitz the pv from the program, so that was not Christophe's reasoning for not
>>>joining.
>>>
>>>I think that if a program is automated is enough to play in the next CCT. If not
>>>then we might have the same result.
>>
>>
>>I like the kibitzing rule.  It's fun to see what each engine is thinking.  I had
>>one game where my engine's eval was almost 2 pawns different from my opponent's
>>engine, so we began discussing the details of our evaluation functions.  This is
>>much better than keeping all this stuff hidden and mysterious.
>>
>>
>>-Peter
>
>
>I agree fully with your comments.  Personally, I could care less that the
>commercial programs were not there.  They contribute exactly zero to computer
>chess, IMO.

I disagree.

I do not need them in that tournament but saying that the contribute exactly
zero to computer chess is wrong.

Ed the programmer of Rebel contributed to computer chess by discovering a lot of
information and other programmers also may follow him in the future.

Uri



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