Author: Don Dailey
Date: 13:08:21 09/25/98
Go up one level in this thread
On September 25, 1998 at 05:43:53, Steve Blatchford wrote: >On September 25, 1998 at 03:31:45, Don Dailey wrote: > >> >>Hi Fernando, >> >>I want to make a couple of points here. First of all your post is >>extremely pessimistic and I believe also unrealistic which I'll >>explain shortly. >> >> >>> The ?sortie? of Thorsten has rekindled once again the old issue of how we pamper >>> the baby without killing him. It is clear CCC will not resist too much time as a >>> living and creative site if more people is going out due to his attacks on this >>> or that guy, followed in the next step by his expulsion. So pressing is this >>> that many post has been dedicated to the task to look for another method of >>> moderation: some of them, IMHO, are a lot worst that the illness they try to >>> cure. >> >> >>I think you are going way overboard here if I may politely disagree. >>First of all, I believe it is nonsense that removing 3 people in >>several months time is tantamount to killing the creativity on this >>site. This site if full of creative thinkers, and creativity on this >>site is not threatened in any way. The way you make is sound, sooner >>or later everyone will be removed until only the 3 moderators are left >>standing, and if you dare say a single word in protest you might be >>next! I find your statements offensive but not you of course, I like >>you and consider you a friend and I hope to meet you someday. >> >>You are making the tremendous (and I think paranoid) leap of logic >>that agreeing and enforcing a no attacks policy is equivalent to >>stifling creativity. This I just cannot accept and will not stand by >>and let a post like this one go unchallenged. >> >>There have been a whole lot of posts very critical of every decision >>we have made. How many of them did we remove? Not a single one of >>them. Did we ever consider removing any of them? It never even >>crossed our minds. Is this consistant with the notion that we are >>interested in supressing your creativity and your ideas? What sort of >>creative expression would you like to make Fernando, that you feel you >>cannot make on this group? Do you think if you post a thought you are >>likely to be censored? I don't think you feel this way but perhaps I >>am wrong? >> >>You are a man of words, with unusual literary skills. It seems ironic >>to me that you do not seem to understand that words can do much more >>damage than any action can. It is criticism and personal attacks that >>suppress creativity and the expression of thoughts. I suspect you are >>a good parent, but do you suppose that if you were constantly critical >>of your children they would thrive because you were free to be >>creative and criticize them in any way you see fit? I susupect this >>would be a powerfully supressive influence on them and your children >>would grow up to be either inhibited or abusive. I know from talking >>to you that you are not this way with your children, so you do seem to >>have an intuitive grasp of what I am saying. >> >>The truth of the matter, even if you do not want to admit this, is >>that in a small society like ours, a certain level of politeness MUST >>be maintained in order to have the maximum amount of freedom to >>express yourself. Freedom is always a relative thing Fernando. You >>have the freedom to jump off the roof if you want to, but this is >>certain to encroach upon your freedom to live. A wild free for all >>where no discipline is maintained is no freedom at all. Why do you >>think so many people have chosen a moderated newsgroup and why do you >>think this one is thriving? >> >>I took this chance with you because I know you are one (as you say in >>your post) who can listen to some constructive criticism. I am taking >>you at your word and asking you to soften your viewpoint just a little >>bit towards a more human approach. >> >>- Don >> >> > >This is so sad. > >You mean well, but you're caught in an impossible situation, not of your making. > >Not grounded at all. No tools. Just a mess. > >And the wheel is still in spin. > >Steve I don't feel this way Steve but I appreciate the compassion you show. Actually, I think 90% of the group feels the same way I do. I think there are a very tiny few (making a huge amount of noise) some on the extreme left and a few on the extreme right who are making it seem that no one can agree on anything. But I don't think this is the case at all! We know this is true because we have had many positive posts and positive emails. And the critical stuff we are getting is always extreme, we are either violating peoples civil liberties or we our permissive liberals afraid to apply stern discipline. My main point in this discussion is that I firmly believe both points of view are just plain unreasonable. If you happen to be one of these extremes of course you will not agree with me. But in a group full of people from one extreme to another with most firmly planted in between, what do you expect? I really believe that MOST of the group knows most of this stuff has been blown way out of proportion and would have more or less made the same decisions we have. If you want to do an experiment, suggest an idea or a concept and do not address it to anyone in particular, just claim it is about to be implemented. I don't care what your idea is, or how reasonable you think it is, just stand back and watch the sparks fly, because it will offend someone! - Don
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