Author: Rolf Tueschen
Date: 12:38:14 01/27/03
Go up one level in this thread
On January 27, 2003 at 15:01:00, Robert Hyatt wrote: >On January 27, 2003 at 11:36:28, Sune Fischer wrote: > >>On January 27, 2003 at 10:57:26, Matthew Hull wrote: >> >>>[snip] >>> >>> >>>>When did Junior ever "remember" the table bases? >>> >>>When did Frenzee ever remember the Ruy Lopez? Same issue, yes? But I don't see >>>you arguing that opening books are unfair, a la Rolf Tueschen. >> >>That doesn't mean I don't agree with Rolf :) >> >>I just think it is possible to put a bit more of the engine personality into the >>book, for instance with learning. If you win against a higher rated player, >>remember this position as good, if you lose to a lower rated player don't play >>this again. >> >>However, you can see clearly from the discussions going on here that the book is >>not perceived as being part of Junior, statements like: "Junior was lost out of >>book" clearly distinguishes the engine "Junior" from the book _used_ by Junior. >>It is as though Junior didn't lose, it was the book that lost the game on behalf >>of Junior! This is also the natural way to think, it really is two very >>different pieces of software. > >I don't agree. I have heard _many_ humans say "I got into a lost position from >the book line I played." Did they play the line, did they remember it, or did >they do _both_??? Surely you didn't hear GM talk this way becauase it would be a contradiction in itself because GM don't have books. They have analyses. But these are not books yet. Of course GM remember their analyses but at least it's their stuff. > >I don't think the line is that sharp between book and engine, particularly when >there >is "learning" involved. > > >> >>The same applies to the egtbs, Junior wouldn't be winning, the egtbs would be. > >Suppose Junior had the code to _build_ the egtbs built in? What then? > >Suppose the EGTBs could be built on the fly, on demand, while the program was >running. What then? Suppose the engine would create a new engine on the fly - say Junior would give birth to Fritz on the fly. Then Kasparov could really take the train back to Moscow. BTW I announce copyright for that idea in CC! Why should that be impossible? Could a Grandmaster NOT change his personality in the middle of a game??? Aha! Bingo. QED. 500000$$$ please. :) Rolf Tueschen > > > > >> >>However I must agree (I guess) that "the machine" is all of the above, so >>depends on what you want from the match. I think Kasparov wanted to play Junior >>and not the egtbs, so for that reason I think the rules are fine. >> >>-S. >> >> >>>:) >>>Matt
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