Author: Andrew Williams
Date: 13:21:16 02/05/03
Go up one level in this thread
On February 05, 2003 at 16:02:01, Chessfun wrote: >On February 05, 2003 at 15:52:38, Andrew Williams wrote: > >>On February 05, 2003 at 15:48:56, Chessfun wrote: >> >>>On February 05, 2003 at 15:41:55, Andrew Williams wrote: >>> >>>>On February 05, 2003 at 15:19:46, Chessfun wrote: >>>> >>>>>On February 05, 2003 at 15:16:48, Andrew Williams wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>On February 05, 2003 at 14:45:55, Ulrich Tuerke wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>On February 05, 2003 at 11:47:49, Steffen Jakob wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>On February 05, 2003 at 02:08:02, Daniel Mehrmannn wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>Whats new: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>* New analyze function: You can now analyze observe games on a InternetServer >>>>>>>>> and put output to channels, games and people. >>>>>>>>> (See option->ICS settings) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>Others have done something similar too, but didn't make it public because it >>>>>>>>would be a powerful tool for cheating at internet chess servers. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Steffen, I guess, you are talking about use of computer in a non-computer >>>>>>>account. >>>>>>>I'm afraid, I can't follow: why is kibitzing a "powerful tool for cheating" ? >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Uli >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>As I understand it, this feature would allow an unscrupulous ICC member to do >>>>>>this: >>>>>> >>>>>>1. Log in using Blitzin using their normal handle >>>>>>2. Log in as a guest using Winboard with an attached program running >>>>>>3. Issue a "follow <my_handle>" command from the guest account >>>>>>4. Set the program attached to Winboard to analyze mode >>>>>> >>>>>>The program will "see" all the moves from the member's game and will output its >>>>>>analysis locally. An unscrupulous player could use the moves from the program >>>>>>instead of playing himself. >>>>>> >>>>>>This is similar to the functionality that Bob uses to allow crafty to write its >>>>>>analysis to ch211 during live transmission of big games on ICC. The difference >>>>>>is that Bob has not made his code generally available, because of the >>>>>>opportunity it offers to cheats. >>>>>> >>>>>>Andrew >>>>> >>>>>But you could do any of that now with Fritz or Tiger log in normally and have >>>>>another piece of software running, I don't see the difference. >>>>> >>>>>Sarah. >>>> >>>> >>>>I don't have those programs. Are you saying that Fritz and Tiger can "watch" >>>>your game over your shoulder, without being logged in as themselves? If you mean >>>>that you could manually transfer the moves, I believe that is less of a problem. >>>>Anyhow, Daniel has said that this feature will not be available to everyone >>>>anyway, so it's a moot point to some extent. >>>> >>>>Andrew >>> >>>You can log in as a guest using Tiger and watch the game with Tiger in analysis >>>mode and if your logged on as a player and want to cheat then you can. Same as >>>far as I know with any program. Actually manually moving should make more sense >>>to a cheat as it would be harder on time per move, recaptures etc to track the >>>cheat. >>> >>>Sarah. >>> >> >>I didn't know that. I guess that means that this is the first free (as in not >>costing anything) possibility to do that. On the other issue, manually moving >>makes it easier to spot cheats, in my opinion. > > >I think you've lost me. >Winboard could always be used to either watch a game with analysis while a user >had another window open. In this case, the player would have to manually switch windows to make the moves on Winboard's board. > Or user could simply log on with winboard and have a PC >running excepting that "username" vars would indicate that. > Right. It's not possible to cheat this way. >I don't see how this version does anything different from what could already be >done. > What we can't do with standard-issue winboard is tell it to "observe" a game, and yet keep the game up to date on its internal board, so that it can spit out analysis. In other words, it can't automatically analyse a game that it is not playing itself. I think this is correct, but I confess I'm confusing myself now. Andrew
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