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Subject: Re: Business deals NOT Conspiracies

Author: Jonas Cohonas

Date: 04:31:30 02/06/03

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>Thanks so much.
>
>For me real names were important. I always hated the hypocrisy of those who
>called themselves Karin's Dad and who then censored people.
>
>I knew that your nick wasn't real. And I take it as a serious case of
>desinformation.

If my identity was important to the content of my post i could understand this,
but since it did not, i must admit i find this a wee bit strange :) however i
respect that you feel this way.

>Then, you must not exaggerate my comment on "we", you are right, I use it too.
>But I saw it being misused in your message. And I still hold it.

Misused how exactly? i was referring to the fact that hopefully i am not making
this forum up and others actually posts here ;)

Example, the reporter ask the bypasser what happened when the police arrested
the two people demontrating and the bypasser answers: "we were standing there
minding our own business..." "we" about people he have never met before, but
felt a connection with.

>You are not honest, starting with name, and also with your hidden lobbyism for
>the show&money side. I discovered it and commented.

Well Rolf (if that is indeed your real name, for all i know it could be Fritz:)
You are censoring me by saying: "You are not honest, starting with name, and
also with your hidden lobbyism for the show&money side. I discovered it and
commented."

You say this as if it was true and you end this post with: "In case you are not
lobbying and you wrote only your very personal opinion I am certainly sorry if
you felt unfairly attacked"

That's the point i did not feel attacked, i was attacked as i was not lobbying,
but you let it be up to my feelings to decide, instead of saying "if i attacked
you unfairly...".

>My own name was always the same. Only in two cases I used a nick because of the
>censorship of the forum. NB I never used my nick for personal attacks. It was as
>a persoal experiment because under Rolf many light weight readers always tended
>to see the 22 y. old Rolf of rgcc in 1996/7. How widespread lightweights are
>could be seen when you imagine that at the time I wrote under my real name, had
>my official term of job in my email address and still people took me for a kid.
>That was really an interesting experience too.

When you meet someone in "real" life you get to know them on a personal level
and at a certain point you have no doubt that they are who they claim to be,
(not that i have personally ever wondered) on the internet it is a different
story, you have people using aliases, only their first name etc, but the fact is
that unless someone here is a public figure, there is no way of knowing if they
really exits or not, no matter how "real" their name sounds.

I lived in Spain for 2 years and got Spanish friends who quickly came up with
the nickname Jonas Cohonas and it has stuck ever since, i have never tried to
hide my real name and have on several occations gladly passed it on in this
forum, when someone asked. I tell you this, because it seems very important to
you that the person you have a discussion with is has a "real" identity, for
future reference you are welcome to mail me with any questions you might have, i
welcome free speech as much as you do.

>Finally - since that time in the mid nineties I know that massive commercial
>interests, although comparably small in CC, govern the scene in public
>discussion sites. This leads to a shift exactly into the direction of the inner
>logic of such an article you wrote. Instead of free exchange of ideas and also
>opinions, what I always prefered, we saw a typical peer group behaviour.
>Critical questios or ideas were imediately defamated as illoyal and dangerous
>for the whole group. Today I am happy to be a member of this American group,
>because only here it seems possible to exert the right of free speech. In all
>German fora you must accept the heat ifyou ask questions about the specifically
>false product, because it's from theother side or could influence the marketing
>and stuff like that.
>
>I for one always relied on the power of my own arguments and ideas. I don't get
>into depressio if people do't understand or like me. That is a normal effect. I
>don't like those who - under legend that they just put their very personal
>opinions - just ract on the critical situation in the group and try to support
>the criticized side. Your position is simply weak, tosay the least. Because all
>ideas or theories we post here are just questionable messages. Not "facts" as
>you tried to insinuate. What you tried is the proposal that lays should step
>back and wait util "experts" start talking. And that is the problem. Because our
>experts, i chess, who are interested in such CC, are engaged for the show. What
>should they have to say? Ashley, Seirawan talked so much in 97 but also then
>they never really cared for the top question of the event in combination with
>Kasparov's "problems". I have all the transcripts of their stage appearances.
>It's all on the level where they hurt nobody. Well, that is exactly the deal. We
>have always the same picture. People confuse critic with rejection and contempt,
>which is big nonsense. It is simply weired that CC is ot smarter. We have too
>many uneducated lays who are button&features experts like the kids who play all
>night long for the World Championships in Doom or whatelse. But we have few who
>have learned the tolerance of a free exchange.
>Even here I am unable to persuade people how important the debate about
>"allowed" features in CC could be for as possible tournament chess
>participation. Imediately people think that I want to handicap CC. But again
>here I could survive after a short debate. Which is impossible in German lobby
>groups.
>
>I case you are not lobbying and you wrote only your very persoal opinion I am
>certainly sorryif you feeled unfairly attacked. But I only tried to describe the
>situation during such a show event.
>
>Rolf Tueschen

I can assure you that i am not lobbying and that i was simply expressing my
opinions.

I did not FEEL attacked, only thing i have a problem with is that you make me
out to be "preaching", "ordering", "lobbying", you are the first person on the
internet i have come across who see's using a nickname is dishonest and "a
serious case of desinformation" :)

You should keep in mind that for me to be speaking "for one side" requires me to
believe that there is "another side" however like i said, i think you are seing
ghosts and by that i am saying i disagree with you, i am not saying that you are
wrong, i am saying that i THINK you are wrong.

You put a second header saying "Business deals NOT Conspiracies" when i wrote my
original post, i was only referring to those people actually using the term
conspiracy, not those trying to look past their own paranoia.

Truth is simply this, i got tired of some people using the term conspiracy in
relation to these matches and spoke out, no hidden agenda.

Regards
Jonas




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