Author: Uri Blass
Date: 07:37:36 03/10/03
Go up one level in this thread
On March 10, 2003 at 10:33:31, emerson tan wrote: >On March 10, 2003 at 07:43:25, Uri Blass wrote: > >>On March 10, 2003 at 07:27:45, Jorge Pichard wrote: >> >>>On March 10, 2003 at 06:40:07, Drexel,Michael wrote: >>> >>>>On March 10, 2003 at 05:58:13, Jorge Pichard wrote: >>>> >>>>>On March 10, 2003 at 05:34:07, emerson tan wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>what program is best to play correspondece chess against humans? >>>>> >>>>>Unless you are playing against Victor Palciauskas, Shredder 7 or Deep Fritz >>>>>should be excellent programs to analyze any position. >>>> >>>>Not exactly true >>>> >>>>Now the challenge would be >>>>>the chess knowledge the the user has, in case the program choose the wrong move, >>>>>since you have to be able to select the best move based on your knowledge >>>>>of the position. This is where the combination of a good program such as >>>>>Shredder 7.04 and a good correspondence chess player like Steve Ham can make a >>>>>world of a difference. >>>>> >>>>>Jorge >>>> >>>>Shredder 7 is not the best for Correspondence game analysis. >>>>The evaluations are not stable and therefore you cant trust them. >>>>It show you +1.22 in a position and you think this has to be big advantage for >>>>white and when you make the move suggested you get -0.09. You make another move >>>>and you will get +1.34 again. and so on. >>>> >>>>Fritz 8.008 or Fritz 7.008 are much better for Analysis mode. >>>>Shredder 7 might be good for over night analysis. >>>>It is also good for the endgame and it might be good to find ideas in the >>>>middlegame. >>> >>> >>>Probably I was wrong to recomend Shredder 7.04, but in correspondence Chess even >>>if you choose Fritz 8.0008 or Hiarcs 8 for Analysis mode it won't be sufficient >>>against a strong correspondence player; not to even mention Victor >>>the World correspondence chess champion. I remembered back when Mike Valvo >>>crushed pretty badly DT in a 2 games match. Mike crushed it even though DT was >>>thinking many hours per move, and hitting 30 plies in its search. >> >>I do not believe that deep thought hit 30 plies brute force in their search. >>I even do not believe 20 plies in the middle game for deep thought. >> >> I remember >>>reading how shocked the programmers were at how badly the program lost. But >>>probably by now chess programs such as: Hiarcs 8 and Deep Fritz have progressed >>>to the point where they don't get crushed by IM like Mike Valvo, but players >>>like Victor Palciauskas (Correspondence World Champion) can still beat any >>>program in Correspondence Chess. >>> >>>Jorge >> >>I doubt if they can beat it without computer help. >>It is known that top correspondence chess players use >>computers to help them. >> >>I also have doubts if Palciauskas can be sure of beating chess programs >>even when computer help is allowed. >>I suspect that the computers have good chances to get at least a draw. >> >>I think that a player with many computers only to analyze chess positions may >>have a significant advantage in correspondence games because I believe that most >>of the correspondence >>players use only one or maybe 2 computers for their games and they do not >>give their computer a full time job in analyzing chess position. >> >>It may be interesting to know how many computers does Palciauskas use for his >>games(I will not be surprised if we find that he has one computer for every >>opponent). >> >>Uri > > >I think a chess player who has chess knowlege and is good at generating ideas >will become a good correspondence player, you dont need to be tactically gifted >(able to visualize part) because you can work it out by moving the pieces. The >computers cannot still generate ideas and they are still limited by the horizon >effect, running the computer 24 hours can hardly reach 25plies on early >positions. Correspondence chess is the next challenge of computer after it beats >all human players over the board. I think that running the computer for 24 hours can help. I do not say that chess knowledge cannot help but these things do not contradict. It is possible that the same player also think about ideas in the same time that his programs work and decide which positions to analyze based on his ideas. Uri
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