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Subject: Re: The King strongest Blitz settings...

Author: Drexel,Michael

Date: 12:50:49 05/02/03

Go up one level in this thread


On May 02, 2003 at 15:28:07, Kurt Utzinger wrote:

>On May 02, 2003 at 14:37:52, Drexel,Michael wrote:
>
>>On May 02, 2003 at 13:33:01, Kurt Utzinger wrote:
>>
>>>On May 02, 2003 at 12:37:52, Drexel,Michael wrote:
>>>
>>>>On May 02, 2003 at 11:35:51, Kurt Utzinger wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On May 02, 2003 at 09:55:23, Drexel,Michael wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On May 02, 2003 at 05:59:14, Kurt Utzinger wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On May 01, 2003 at 13:36:02, Manfred Meiler wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>On May 01, 2003 at 13:10:04, Brian Thomas wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Subject says it all ... looking for approx the best blitz settings ... thanks!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Brian
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>According Surak's website http://www.grailmaster.com/misc/chess/comp/cm.html the
>>>>>>>>settings "Grailmaster7" and "Tato2" should be very strong in Blitz.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Manfred
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>PS: Grailmaster7 scored very well also in test suite "WM-Test" (100 test
>>>>>>>>positions à 20 minutes).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>    As far as I know, both these settings do not base on a "possible"
>>>>>>>    CM9-setting. We do therefore not know what we are testing. That's a great
>>>>>>>    pity and of course of no help whatsoever for the programmer.
>>>>>>>    Kurt
>>>>>>
>>>>>>There are programmers of the GUI and there is a programmer of TheKing engine.
>>>>>>As Chessmaster 9000 is a mass market product the programmers of the GUI decided
>>>>>>to make the Setup of the personalities as user friendly as possible.
>>>>>>Therefore they use 9,5,3,3,1 for the Material values of the default personality
>>>>>>and not 100,100,100,100,100. The translation is done by the GUI.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Johan de Koning of course is not interested in strong CM9-settings.
>>>>>>He is probably interested in the strongest TheKing-setting, to make the next
>>>>>>default engine version stronger.
>>>>>>I see no problems for the programmer of the engine if there are no possible
>>>>>>CM9-settings.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Michael
>>>>>
>>>>>    Hi Michael
>>>>>    You are wrong. The programmer is only interested in the strongest
>>>>>    CM9-settings which then can be "translated" via the logfile output for use
>>>>>    outside the CM9-GUI. If params are only changed under Fritz-GUI, Johan de
>>>>>    Koning cannot identify the original parameters of his engine. I know this
>>>>>    for sure and that's the reason why I am always asking for the original
>>>>>    CM9-settings and why I strictly avoid to use settings that are not
>>>>>    based on a CM9-GUI-setting. The whole problem has already earlier been
>>>>>    posted here, see http://f11.parsimony.net/forum16635/messages/39159.htm
>>>>>    Kurt
>>>>
>>>>Hi Kurt
>>>>
>>>>I can understand why it would be best to leave the Material/Positional
>>>>value at zero. I also dont change this parameter.
>>>>
>>>>Lets assume a personality is found which performs over 50 ELO better than all
>>>>other personalities and is not based on a CM-GUI-setting.
>>>>Do you really think Johan de Koning could not reconstruct the reason for this?
>>>
>>>   Yes, reconstruction is simply not possible.
>>>   Kurt
>>
>>Ich meinte nachvollziehen was die Ursache sein könnte und die richtigen
>>Schlußfolgerungen ziehen. Ich bin sicher das
>>dies einem so guten Schachprogrammierer gelingen sollte.
>>
>>>>
>>>>The problem with the CM-GUI-settings is simply you cant set slightly
>>>>asymmetric material parameters for Knight,Bishop and Rook.
>>>>You sometimes (especially if you have a personality with a risky style) want The
>>>>King to not trade material if there is an equal strong
>>>>possibility and on the other hand you dont want to weaken The Kings play too
>>>>much.
>>>>To set myb=123 and opb=116 can only weaken the program but myb=101 and opb=100
>>>>could slightly improve its strength.
>>>
>>>    Hard to say in my opinion. My experience show [it's sometimes unbelievable]
>>>    that even a very small ajdustment of a single parameter can influence the
>>>    behaviour of the engine in a never expected manner. I have often thought
>>>    that slightly changing a specific parameter should give better results, but
>>>    the contrary was the case. I came to the conclusion that all this has
>>>    nothing to do with logic, it's merely a matter of testing, testing and
>>>    again testing.
>>>    Kurt
>>
>>Sure, its never possible to predict the behaviour of a program if you change the
>>default settings.
>>You cant deny that it is possible that a None-CM-GUI-setting is stronger than
>>all possible CM-GUI-settings.
>>I see no reason why people shouldnt try it.
>>Of course I respect your joice not to do it.
>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>I think Johan the Koning is not happy about the fact that people use
>>>>TheKing outside the Chessmaster GUI because this is not in the interest of
>>>>Ubi-Soft and he eventually gets his money from them.
>>>
>>>    We can see this the other way round. Quite a lof of people have purchased
>>>    Chessmaster 9000 only for the purpose to have a very strong engine for
>>>    matches in the ChessBase or in other GUI's like Arena, ChessAssistant. As
>>>    long as an original CM9-CD is required to do so, Ubi Soft will not claim I
>>>    think.
>>>    Kurt
>>
>>Unfortunately now people can run TheKing engine in Chessbase with the patch
>>someone mentioned here because it is not longer required to have an original CD
>>now. I recogniced that it is very common to trade engines per email.
>>I had purchased Shredder 7 CD very early and played some games with it at
>>playchess.com. I had to close the chat window because I recieved a lot of
>>requests to send it to others. They even offered me a bunch of commercial
>>engines to trade.
>
>     But in the case of Shredder7 this would not help. In view of the
>     protection mode, Shredder7 will not run if you do not possess the
>     original CD.
>     Kurt

Yes, but many guys (and very few girls) at playchess.com are not so experienced
in CC like you are. They probably thought it would work.

Michael

>
>>I returned a weak later and not a single person asked me to trade it ...
>>
>>Michael
>>
>>>>
>>>>Michael



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