Computer Chess Club Archives


Search

Terms

Messages

Subject: Re: Unnecessary Underpromotions

Author: Gerd Isenberg

Date: 09:57:47 05/22/03

Go up one level in this thread


On May 22, 2003 at 11:42:45, Ulrich Tuerke wrote:

>On May 22, 2003 at 11:16:18, David H. McClain wrote:
>
>>On May 22, 2003 at 08:41:56, Ulrich Tuerke wrote:
>>
>>>On May 22, 2003 at 06:08:47, José Carlos wrote:
>>>
>>>>On May 22, 2003 at 01:01:38, Robin Smith wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Often programs will underpromote a pawn in situations where they think capturing
>>>>>the (under)promoted piece is still the best reply. Can anyone give an example
>>>>>from an actual game where this underspromotion cost the computer a 1/2 point?
>>>>>
>>>>>Robin
>>>>
>>>>  I can't recall any game with this problem, but it's really easy to fix. I
>>>>simply order the promotions so that promoting to queen gets searched first.
>>>
>>>Isn't everybody doing this anyway ?
>>>Uli
>>>
>>>> The
>>>>all the other underpromotions will return alpha and thus ignored.
>>>>
>>>>  José C.
>>
>>Jose,
>>
>>No, everyone is not doing this.  At least I am not.   Admittedly I have played
>>only one game where an underpromotion was an absolute necessity to regain tempo
>>and obtain a "check" to prevent a checkmate to the other side. This was to a
>>knight promotion rather than a Queen.  And the game was eventually won with the
>>knight promotion.  I'm sure others have witnessed this on occasion also.
>>
>>Don't ask me to find and post this game.  I don't know where or if I have it but
>>I simply regarded it as "the program knows best" and let it go at that.  The
>>program was correct..........
>
>I don't think that we are talking about omitting under-promotions but about
>move-ordering solely.
>
>When generating moves in full search, I sort promotions like
>
>1. queen
>2. knight
>3. rook
>4. bishop
>
>That's because rook or bishop promotions will only very rarely generate a cut in
>a case where the queen doesn't. Usually, the queen will do anyway.
>
>However, the knight may be a serious alternative to a queen promotion.
>Therefore, I prefer it to rook and bishop.
>
>This way, you can't miss a win by knight promotion.
>
>In quies search, I omit (3) and (4).
>
>Uli

Hi Uli,

i do some kind of conditional delayed minor promotion move generation.
Depending on the outcome of the queen promotion, assuming the queen promotion
don't cuts, i omit all minor promotions or at least rook and bishop promotions.

If the best reply of the opponent after doing the queen promotion is a capture
of this queen, i see no need to even generate any minor promotion, except at the
root and except knight promotion checks (maybe a rare double check). I also omit
rook and bishop promotions, if the queen promotion returns no draw (stalemate)
score.

Gerd



This page took 0 seconds to execute

Last modified: Thu, 15 Apr 21 08:11:13 -0700

Current Computer Chess Club Forums at Talkchess. This site by Sean Mintz.