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Subject: Re: Science, Truth & Computer Chess [And ChessBase]

Author: Rolf Tueschen

Date: 02:50:11 06/20/03

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On June 20, 2003 at 05:38:03, Uri Blass wrote:

>On June 20, 2003 at 05:20:47, Rolf Tueschen wrote:
>
>>Computer Chess came out of the science "computer sciences". Later scientists and
>>becoming scientists came together and made a little tournament with their
>>machines. They found rules that were enough for them - because they were
>>basically scientists, so never they would have cheated each other. They had a so
>>called gentleman's agreement about possible cheats.
>>
>>Now let's stop the historical summary for a moment of thought.
>>
>>As I wrote computer chess has no inborn rules against cheating. More, it is
>>technically impossible to prevent cheatings. As long as scientists are
>>participating that is no big problem, but what happens if people participate who
>>simply have no idea what science is? We get a real problem. All kind of private
>>routines are presented with their private results although that can't be
>>accepted as scientific procedures. The answer is, privately we can do what we
>>want, science is for labs. This is a gross misunderstanding. Simply because back
>>through the bathroom window these same people claim that their results have
>>validity. But that exactly implies science because without certain exact
>>procedures you can't get validity of your data. So that is leading you into a
>>deadly circle.
>>
>>Scientists get their income from scientific institutions. Look at Bob who gives
>>his Crafty for free but who gets enough money as Professor. Now we have certain
>>people without such an income who therefore use business technology. Now where
>>is the scientific control here? As you know software in general is a fine
>>medium. Errors are called bugs and sold as if - they had no bugs, but if they
>>have, the users give precious feedback for the business companies. In short
>>there is no scientific control whatsoever. Brilliant for the business companies.
>>They are mainly amateurs (and Christians in the majority) who do a charity job
>>for the million users. The products (programs) are tested by - again - amateur
>>testers. So all without validity. All without a way to complain if something
>>goes wrong.
>>
>>Can you follow me what I mean if I say that non-scientists, amateurs and charity
>>people sell something that we should NEVER expect scientific reliability? Not to
>>speak of validity. Excuse the many scientific terms.
>>
>>Can you also follow me that if such amateurs want to make money, NB that
>>Kasparov or Amir Ban got thousands of dollars for their show event meant as PR
>>action for the ChessBase program Junior, that then they must create a bit of hot
>>air, they must "make a little cheat" about the content of the box they are
>>selling? Of course they must say that Junior is GM!! Since Kasparov said it. Of
>>course they must shout, that the original engine that played KASPAROV IS IN THE
>>BOX!! If they didn't they were bad amateurs or - -  well, just scientists. But
>>since they aren't all is kosher.
>>
>>Look, when I bought Fritz 8 I suffered of the same mental attack all the Junior
>>8 customers suffered from, I believed that I could finally use the new feature
>>with the 3D pieces. I did NEVER think about my old PC who simply had not the
>>modern graphics which were necessary to be able to profit from the new features!
>>The same with Junior 8. Against Kasparov the prog ran on extremely expensive
>>hardware. Obviously nobody around has such a machine. So by force nobody can use
>>the exact program that played Kasparov. But that was exactly what the PR of
>>ChessBase told us. But for real computer freaks - is that a surprise?? Is that a
>>cheat?? Of course NOT. Since we are totally out of science.
>
>The fact that nobody has the hardware does not mean that nobody can use the
>exact program that played kasparov.
>
>If the same program can run on slower hardware then it means that people can get
>the same program and expect it usually to play the same moves if they give it
>enough time.

Astonishing that you make that mistake. The indeterminism by parallelism is
still leading to a non-comparable situation if you let time pass on you
1-processor machine.

Rolf



>
>Uri



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