Author: Slater Wold
Date: 09:36:21 06/27/03
Go up one level in this thread
On June 27, 2003 at 11:25:19, Uri Blass wrote: >I am not sure if Kh6 is better than h4(both moves are probably losing) I am. They are both losers, because black is lost. But Kh6 prolongs it, per DB's scores/lines & my own analysis last nite. But when you're talking about 'which losing move is better', it's almost impossible to argue either side. Bottom line, they still lose. >Here is some analysis by Fritz8 >It likes Kh6 but changes it's mind later to h4 and I suspect that the same could >happen with deeper blue. DB liked h4 first, and had a pretty even score. I believe it failed low, and it changed Kh6, which had a score of -94 when it played it. I don't know how DBs scoring worked, I just have other lines to compare with. >I do not have the logfile of deeper blue near me but even if it's line is >better(when it considered h4) it does not prove that deeper blue saw the tactics >because better line can be a result of a slightly different evaluation. This was never a 'DB IS BETTER THAN FRITZ 8' post. He said h4 draws. I said no it doesn't. However, DB was seeing things that CM couldn't see in 999s on his machine, and it saw things in 29s which took CM 7 minutes on a P4 2.4Ghz. >New game >[D]3rr3/6k1/2p3P1/1p2nP1p/pP2p1P1/P1B1Nb1B/2P2K2/5R2 b - - 0 1 > >Analysis by Fritz 8: > >1...hxg4-- > ² (0.44) Depth: 7/23 00:00:00 81kN >1...hxg4 2.Bxg4 Kf6 3.Bxf3 exf3 4.Rg1 c5 5.Ng4+ Kxf5 6.Nxe5 cxb4 > ± (1.06) Depth: 7/27 00:00:00 177kN >1...Rd6! > ± (1.03) Depth: 7/27 00:00:00 184kN >1...Rd6! > ± (0.87) Depth: 7/27 00:00:00 193kN >1...Rd6 2.g5 Kf8 3.Bxe5 Rxe5 4.c4 Rd2+ 5.Kg3 > ± (0.75) Depth: 7/27 00:00:00 200kN >1...Kf6! > ± (0.72) Depth: 7/27 00:00:00 225kN >1...Kf6 2.Rg1 hxg4 3.Bxg4 Bxg4 4.Nxg4+ Kxf5 5.Nxe5 Rxe5 6.Bxe5 > ² (0.62) Depth: 7/27 00:00:00 237kN >1...Kf6-- > ± (0.91) Depth: 8/23 00:00:00 292kN >1...Kf6 2.Rg1 Kg7 > ± (0.91) Depth: 8/26 00:00:01 396kN >1...Rd6! > ± (0.87) Depth: 8/26 00:00:01 422kN >1...Rd6! > ± (0.72) Depth: 8/26 00:00:01 440kN >1...Rd6-- > ± (1.00) Depth: 9/20 00:00:02 633kN >1...Rd6 2.g5 Kf8 > ± (1.00) Depth: 9/22 00:00:02 707kN >1...h4! > ± (0.97) Depth: 9/29 00:00:03 1196kN >1...h4! > ± (0.81) Depth: 9/29 00:00:03 1233kN >1...h4 2.g5 Kg8 3.Bg2 Rd6 4.Bxe5 Rd2+ 5.Kg1 Bxg2 6.Rf2 > ² (0.69) Depth: 9/29 00:00:03 1283kN >1...h4 2.g5 Kg8 3.Ke1 Rd6 4.Bxe5 Rxe5 5.Bg4 Bxg4 6.Nxg4 Re7 7.Ke2 > ² (0.69) Depth: 10/28 00:00:04 1593kN >1...h4 2.g5 Kg8 3.Kg1 Kf8 4.Re1 Rd6 5.Kf2 Nxg6 > ± (0.72) Depth: 11/28 00:00:07 2761kN >1...h4 2.g5 Kg8 3.Bg2 Kf8 4.Bh1 Rd6 5.Bxe5 Rd2+ 6.Kg1 Bxh1 7.Bc3 Re2 > ² (0.59) Depth: 12/32 00:00:15 5828kN >1...h4 2.g5 Kf8 3.Bg2 Bxg2 4.Kxg2 Nf3 5.Rh1 Re7 6.Kf2 > ± (0.75) Depth: 13/34 00:00:29 11999kN >1...h4-- > ± (1.03) Depth: 14/35 00:00:57 24151kN >1...h4 2.g5 Kf8 > ± (1.03) Depth: 14/49 00:01:08 28771kN >1...h4-- > ± (1.31) Depth: 15/39 00:02:52 74580kN >1...h4 2.g5 Kf8 > ± (1.31) Depth: 15/52 00:03:11 83028kN >1...Kh6! > ± (1.28) Depth: 15/52 00:07:08 189665kN >1...Kh6-- > +- (1.56) Depth: 16/39 00:09:30 253728kN >1...Kh6 2.gxh5 Bxh5 > +- (1.56) Depth: 16/63 00:12:44 345407kN >1...h4! > +- (1.53) Depth: 16/63 00:13:08 355882kN >1...h4! > ± (1.37) Depth: 16/63 00:13:32 365719kN > >(, eim 27.06.2003) > >Uri IMO, a 13 minute eval from Fritz 8 is not equal to a 100+ second DB eval. It took DB a couple of seconds to hit your node count. And while I do believe their eval wasn't as advanced as the Fritz/Shredder/Junior of today, I need a little more than 1...h4! and a score to really compare the two evals.
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