Author: Uri Blass
Date: 12:05:45 07/08/03
Go up one level in this thread
On July 08, 2003 at 13:41:56, Amir Ban wrote: >On July 07, 2003 at 09:39:23, Rex wrote: > >It's the sort of position where a program that thinks black is better will lose >quickly. > >Amir or maybe it is also a problem of tactics. I admit that a lot of program underestimate the white pawn at d7 but even with wrong evaluation it may be possible to avoid the losing mistake by search and the question is what was the losing mistake of Hiarcs and if programs can avoid the losing mistake by search inspite of wrong evaluation. It is possible that the losing mistake was earlier but Movei does not like 39...Nc5 and the same for Fritz8. Maybe someone with faster hardware has the time to try to find out the losing mistake(I am not sure at this moment if 39...Bxf3 savea the game or it is only the horizon effect and more time can convince fritz to see that it is losing). Some analysis with p850 New game [D]2Rq1r1k/3P2pp/4B2b/7b/1p1Nnp2/5N1P/8/R6K b - - 0 1 Analysis by Movei00_8_080a: 10...Nf2+ 11.Kg1 -+ (-9.63) Depth: 1 00:00:00 10...Nf2+ 11.Kg1 Nxh3+ 12.Bxh3 -+ (-7.19) Depth: 2 00:00:00 10...Bxf3+ -+ (-7.20) Depth: 2 00:00:00 10...Bxf3+ -+ (-7.49) Depth: 2 00:00:00 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng3+ 12.Kg1 Qb6+ 13.Kg2 -+ (-9.36) Depth: 2 00:00:00 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng3+ 12.Kg1 Qb6+ 13.Kg2 -+ (-9.36) Depth: 2 00:00:00 10...Bxf3+ 11.Kh2 Qe7 12.Rxf8+ Qxf8 13.Nxf3 -+ (-6.55) Depth: 3 00:00:00 10...Nf2+ -+ (-6.56) Depth: 3 00:00:00 10...Bxf3+ 11.Kh2 Qe7 12.Rxf8+ Qxf8 13.Nxf3 -+ (-6.55) Depth: 3 00:00:00 10...Bxf3+ 11.Kh2 Qe7 12.Rxf8+ Qxf8 13.Nxf3 -+ (-6.55) Depth: 3 00:00:00 10...Bxf3+ 11.Kh2 Qf6 12.Rxf8+ Qxf8 13.Nxf3 Qd8 -+ (-6.81) Depth: 4 00:00:00 10...Bxf3+ 11.Kh2 Qf6 12.Rxf8+ Qxf8 13.Nxf3 Qd8 -+ (-6.81) Depth: 4 00:00:00 10...Bxf3+ 11.Kh2 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nxf3 Nxf3+ 14.Kg2 -+ (-5.33) Depth: 5 00:00:00 10...Bxf3+ 11.Kh2 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nxf3 Nxf3+ 14.Kg2 -+ (-5.33) Depth: 5 00:00:00 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng3+ 12.Kh2 Qf6 13.Rxf8+ Qxf8 14.Ne5 Bg5 15.Nf7+ Kg8 16.Nxg5+ Kh8 -+ (-2.73) Depth: 6 00:00:01 116kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng3+ 12.Kh2 Qf6 13.Rxf8+ Qxf8 14.Ne5 Bg5 15.Nf7+ Kg8 16.Nxg5+ Kh8 -+ (-2.73) Depth: 6 00:00:01 159kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Nc5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nd4 Bg5 14.Ra7 Nxe6 15.Nxe6 -+ (-2.41) Depth: 7 00:00:01 224kN 10...Nc5 -+ (-2.42) Depth: 7 00:00:02 261kN 10...Nc5 11.Rxd8 Bxf3+ 12.Nxf3 Rxd8 13.Bf5 g5 14.Rd1 Kg7 -+ (-2.53) Depth: 7 00:00:02 285kN 10...Nc5 11.Rxd8 Bxf3+ 12.Nxf3 Rxd8 13.Bf5 g5 14.Rd1 Kg7 -+ (-2.53) Depth: 7 00:00:02 369kN 10...Nc5 11.Rxd8 Bxf3+ 12.Nxf3 Rxd8 13.Bg4 g5 14.Ne5 Kg7 15.Kg2 -+ (-2.39) Depth: 8 00:00:03 422kN 10...Nc5 11.Rxd8 Bxf3+ 12.Nxf3 Rxd8 13.Bg4 g5 14.Ne5 Kg7 15.Kg2 -+ (-2.39) Depth: 8 00:00:05 869kN 10...Nc5 11.Rxc5 Bxf3+ 12.Nxf3 b3 13.Rc8 b2 14.Rb1 Qe7 15.Rxf8+ Qxf8 16.Rxb2 µ (-1.01) Depth: 9 00:00:07 1154kN 10...Bxf3+ µ (-1.02) Depth: 9 00:00:07 1167kN 10...Bxf3+ µ (-1.31) Depth: 9 00:00:07 1179kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nxg5 Bxg5 14.Kg2 Be7 15.Rf1 g5 16.Kf3 -+ (-1.58) Depth: 9 00:00:17 2649kN 10...Ng5 -+ (-1.59) Depth: 9 00:00:22 3421kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nxg5 Bxg5 14.Kg2 Be7 15.Rf1 g5 16.Kf3 -+ (-1.58) Depth: 9 00:00:22 3433kN 10...Bg5 -+ (-1.59) Depth: 9 00:00:26 4004kN 10...Bg5 -+ (-1.88) Depth: 9 00:00:30 4639kN 10...Bg5 11.Nxg5 Nxg5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Kg2 f3+ 14.Kf2 Ne4+ 15.Ke3 Nc5 16.Ra7 Nxe6 17.Nxe6 -+ (-1.77) Depth: 9 00:00:38 5777kN 10...Bg5 11.Nxg5 Nxg5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Kg2 f3+ 14.Kf2 Ne4+ 15.Ke3 Nc5 16.Ra7 Nxe6 17.Nxe6 -+ (-1.77) Depth: 9 00:00:43 6570kN 10...Bg5 11.Nxg5 Nxg5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Kg2 f3+ 14.Kf2 Ne4+ 15.Ke3 Nc5 16.Ra7 Nxe6 17.Nxe6 -+ (-1.77) Depth: 10 00:00:59 8922kN 10...Bxf3+ -+ (-1.78) Depth: 10 00:01:01 9222kN 10...Bg5 11.Nxg5 Nxg5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Kg2 f3+ 14.Kf2 Ne4+ 15.Ke3 Nc5 16.Ra7 Nxe6 17.Nxe6 -+ (-1.77) Depth: 10 00:01:04 9561kN 10...Bg5 11.Nxg5 Nxg5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Kg2 f3+ 14.Kf2 Ne4+ 15.Ke3 Nc5 16.Ra7 Nxe6 17.Nxe6 -+ (-1.77) Depth: 10 00:01:19 11585kN 10...Bg5 11.Nxg5 Nxg5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Kh2 Bf3 14.Rf1 Bb7 15.Rxf4 Nxe6 16.Nxe6 µ (-1.04) Depth: 11 00:02:17 20137kN 10...Bxf3+ µ (-1.05) Depth: 11 00:02:38 23315kN 10...Bxf3+ µ (-1.34) Depth: 11 00:02:39 23477kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nxg5 Bxg5 14.Rf1 g6 15.h4 Bxh4 16.Rxf4 Be7 17.Kg2 -+ (-1.64) Depth: 11 00:02:46 24571kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nxg5 Bxg5 14.Rf1 g6 15.h4 Bxh4 16.Rxf4 Be7 17.Kg2 -+ (-1.64) Depth: 11 00:03:48 33842kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nd4 g6 14.Bg4 Bg7 15.Re1 Rg8 16.Re8 Nf7 17.Be6 µ (-1.40) Depth: 12 00:04:05 36463kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nd4 g6 14.Bg4 Bg7 15.Re1 Rg8 16.Re8 Nf7 17.Be6 µ (-1.40) Depth: 12 00:06:26 58142kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nd4 g6 14.Bg4 Bg7 15.Re1 Bxd4 16.Re8+ Kg7 17.Rxd8 Nf7 18.Re8 µ (-0.96) Depth: 13 00:07:55 71389kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nd4 g6 14.Bg4 Bg7 15.Re1 Bxd4 16.Re8+ Kg7 17.Rxd8 Nf7 18.Re8 µ (-0.96) Depth: 13 00:15:04 138412kN New game 2Rq1r1k/3P2pp/4B2b/7b/1p1Nnp2/5N1P/8/R6K b - - 0 1 Analysis by Fritz 8: 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Nc5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Bg4 b3 14.Rb1 -+ (-1.94) Depth: 6/38 00:00:00 209kN 10...Nc5! -+ (-1.97) Depth: 6/38 00:00:00 320kN 10...Nc5-- -+ (-1.69) Depth: 7/17 00:00:00 340kN 10...Nc5 11.Rxc5 Bxf3+ -+ (-1.69) Depth: 7/19 00:00:00 353kN 10...Nc5 11.Rxc5 Bxf3+ 12.Nxf3 Qf6 13.Rd1 Rd8 14.Rc8 g5 -+ (-1.75) Depth: 8/22 00:00:01 628kN 10...Nc5-- -+ (-1.47) Depth: 9/23 00:00:02 960kN 10...Nc5 11.Rxc5 Bxf3+ -+ (-1.47) Depth: 9/28 00:00:02 1040kN 10...Nc5-- µ (-1.19) Depth: 10/23 00:00:04 2167kN 10...Nc5 11.Rxc5 Bxf3+ µ (-1.19) Depth: 10/38 00:00:05 2443kN 10...Bxf3+! µ (-1.22) Depth: 10/38 00:00:05 2526kN 10...Bxf3+! µ (-1.38) Depth: 10/38 00:00:05 2590kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Nc5 12.Rxc5 Qf6 13.Ra6 Rd8 14.Rc8 -+ (-1.47) Depth: 10/38 00:00:06 2944kN 10...Bxf3+-- µ (-1.19) Depth: 11/34 00:00:11 5740kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nxg5 Bxg5 14.Kg2 Bf6 15.Ra4 Bc3 16.Kf3 g5 µ (-1.06) Depth: 11/44 00:00:20 10507kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nxg5 Bxg5 14.Kg2 Bf6 15.Rb1 Bc3 16.Kf3 g5 17.h4 µ (-0.97) Depth: 12/35 00:00:35 18693kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nxg5 Bxg5 14.Kg2 Bf6 15.Rb1 Rb8 µ (-0.72) Depth: 13/36 00:01:05 34772kN 10...Bxf3+-- ³ (-0.44) Depth: 14/38 00:02:21 77124kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 ³ (-0.44) Depth: 14/53 00:02:30 81890kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nd4 g6 14.Rc1 Bg7 15.Rc8 Bf6 16.h4 ³ (-0.44) Depth: 15/46 00:04:56 163145kN 10...Bxf3+-- = (-0.16) Depth: 16/49 00:09:37 313163kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 = (-0.16) Depth: 16/49 00:10:13 334563kN 10...Bxf3+ 11.Nxf3 Ng5 12.Rxd8 Rxd8 13.Nd4 g6 14.Bg4 Bg7 15.Re1 Bf6 16.Nc6 Rg8 17.Nxb4 = (-0.22) Depth: 17/44 00:24:25 783523kN (, eim 08.07.2003) Uri
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