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Subject: Re: The need to unmake move

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 08:40:22 08/26/03

Go up one level in this thread


On August 26, 2003 at 03:13:00, Johan de Koning wrote:

>On August 25, 2003 at 18:28:24, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>
>>On August 25, 2003 at 18:14:15, Sune Fischer wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>>(status quo).
>>>
>>>Right, saw that one too late :)
>>>
>>>>That is exactly what I said.  The issue is how many copy/makes have to be
>>>>done per unit of time.  Or how many units of time it takes to do a single
>>>>copy/make.  Depends on your time scale (1s or 1ns).
>>>>
>>>>A single cpu that will run crafty at 1M nps has a cache-cache and cache-memory
>>>>bandwidth of X bytes/second.  A single cpu that runs crafty at 2M nps has
>>>>exactly twice the cache-cache and cache-memory bandwidth and twice the clock
>>>>frequency.  A dual-cpu just needs two cpus, but the two cpus give twice the
>>>>cache-cache bandwidth, but _no_ improvement in cache-memory bandwidth.
>>>>
>>>>This was all about memory bandwidth with respect to copy/make.
>>>
>>>Aaah, and here lies our source of disagreement.
>>>
>>>I was always talking about cache to cache, or as Johan wrote "C2C" bandwidth.
>>>
>>>I think the assumptions for make/uncopy to match make/umake is that the stack
>>>fits in cache, or else it will be heavily outgunned, even on a single.
>>>
>>>I doubt anyone disagrees with you there.
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>You made it sound like 2.4 was much worse than 1, which is just a silly
>>>>>comparison at best.
>>>>
>>>>Clearly 2.4 _is_ much worse than 1.  It requires 2.4X the bandwidth.
>>>
>>>Yes _if_ you need to go over the bus.
>>>
>>>-S.
>>
>>
>>My stuff will _never_ fit in 512KB of L2, much less the far smaller L1/trace
>>caches (on the PIV).
>>
>>I am _always_ going to be burning the bus.
>
>Exactly!
>The heavily used stuff will *always* be in the cache.
>For the other stuff it doesn't matter much if the remaining cache space is
>either 31 kB or 28 kB, now does it?
>
>... Johan


I don't remember saying that id did matter.  I claimed that for _my_ program,
copy/make burned the bus up and getting rid of it made me go 25% faster.  I
didn't suggest that it would make any other program go 25% faster or slower,
because other programs are likely very different internally.



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