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Subject: Re: To check or not to check, this is the quiescence question

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 12:02:05 10/13/03

Go up one level in this thread


On October 13, 2003 at 12:57:04, José Carlos wrote:

>On October 13, 2003 at 12:03:32, Vincent Diepeveen wrote:
>
>>On October 13, 2003 at 11:31:11, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>
>>>On October 13, 2003 at 09:29:47, Vincent Diepeveen wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>there are very big differences.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>There isn't a big difference if you are only talking about the q-search.
>>>
>>>If you do a check, you have to get out and that extends.  If you extend
>>>on the check you don't extend when you get out and that extends.
>>>
>>>It is different in the normal part of the search, because if you extend on
>>>a check you increase depth by one now.  You might reach the q-search if you
>>>wait to extend when you escape check.  but in the q-search I don't see how it
>>>is a "big difference".
>>
>>You don't have to apologize for not knowing basic tree math, you're excused.
>>Had seen already in crafty code that it was done wrong there.
>>
>>Yet i had already posted years ago at CCC that if you extend when being checked,
>>that this is better than when giving the check.
>>
>>What delivers more cutoffs for the hashtable:
>>
>>A)
>>Re5+ (5 ply remaining)
>>Kf7  (5 ply remaining)
>>Rxa5 (4 ply remaining)
>>
>>B)
>>Re5+ (5 ply remaining)
>>Kf7  (4 ply remaining)
>>Rxa5 (4 ply remaining)
>>
>>If you can answer that question then you'll know the answer to the basic tree
>>searching question.
>>
>>Best regards,
>>Vincent
>
>
>  Do you cutoff in moves or in positions?
>  If you cutoff in positions, then you have:
>
>Extend check:
>
>A -Re5+-> B -Kf7-> C -Rxa5-> D
>5         5        4         3 (depth remaining)
>
>
>Extend out-of-check:
>
>A -Re5+-> B -Kf7-> C -Rxa5-> D
>5         4        4         3 (depth remaining)
>
>  So the only difference is position B. In the first case you store depth 5 in
>the hash table, in the sencond case, 4.
>  In principle it seems that extending checks would give more cutoffs due to
>hash table, but to get to position B you need a checking move, which would
>extend (increase remaining depth) in the first case, and not extend in the
>second.
>  The result seems to be that both will work the same, except for leaf nodes, as
>Bob pointed.
>
>  José C.


Don't fall into his trap.  In the q-search, which I _explicitly_ said I was
talking about exclusively, there is no "depth remaining" to extend.  His
comments are, as always, nonsensical.

If we were talking about the basic search, then things are a bit different.
But I do it my way there for a reason.  It guarantees that I _never_ reach
the q-search when the side-to-move's king is in check.

But we weren't talking about that case in what I wrote and where Vincent
responded with a completely random comment.



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