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Subject: Re: Is I.M. Kaufman the Definitive word???

Author: Steven Schwartz

Date: 09:50:06 11/11/98

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On November 11, 1998 at 12:40:37, Don Dailey wrote:

>On November 10, 1998 at 14:50:07, Reynolds Takata wrote:
>
>>Is I.M. Kaufman, and the recent CCC poll on Comp strength the definitive word on
>>whether comps are GM strength?  I was just wondering because it AMAZES me that
>>after so much debate on the subject that an International Chess Master states in
>>"Computer Chess Web Reports" that he believes that a program "Mchess 8.1" would
>>be able to acquire the 3 grandmaster norms in 40/2 tournaments to acquire the GM
>>title, and that almost no one in the group commented on it.  It's stunning this
>>silence, especially since most CCC members will probably expect other programs
>>(i.e. Rebel10, Fritz, Hiarcs etc.) to be stronger than Mchess.  Of course I know
>>it's not definitive but does this mean that the tide is turning hard against the
>>ney sayers?  Yes i know you might be able to find some other titled players to
>>counter, though I don't know if they know as much about comp chess as Kaufman.
>>Also every time i have asked titled players (5 players) on ICC if Comps could
>>get the norms at 40/2 they all said yes.  Though some didn't think comps could
>>stand up to a lot of GM's in a match but they thought a tournament situation was
>>different.  Though after watching R10 draw anand in a 40/2 game i'm not certain
>>even of that.
>>
>>Reynolds Takata
>>USCF Life Master
>>Fide Master
>>
>>
>>
>>"The last time I checked, the indicated adjustment to convert to USCF
>>ratings was 180, which would give it a predicted USCF rating of 2696. Even a
>>tiny gain would bring the new version over
>>2700, the same level as the top four or five American grandmasters. This is at
>>standard tournament speed (40/2); at fast
>>chess the programs are stronger still. Although I suspect that the method used
>>to get the Swedish ratings tends to exaggerate
>>the ratings of the top programs a bit for several reasons,
>>
>>I do believe that MChess Pro 8.0 would be able to earn the
>>Grandmaster title if given a reasonable number of opportunities to play in GM
>>norm tournaments.
>>
>>
>>In fact, an earlier version
>>(5.0) defeated three Grandmasters in a single six round event (Aegon) at
>>standard time controls. At fast chess, it is a terror;" (Kaufman Nov, 1998)
>
>Is Larry Kaufman the definitive word on whether computers are
>Grandmaster strength yet?  YES, almost.  You don't know this guy
>the way I do.  Although everyone is fallible, I would have a hard
>time pointing to a more reliable source than this to answer this
>question.  Larry knows computer chess like the back of his hand.
>He knows the problems and weaknesses but he also is a strong
>player although he is not a Grandmaster.  His opinion on this will
>be better than almost any grandmaster opinion.  Why do I make this
>ludicrous statement?  Because it doesn't have as much to do with
>strength as it does to objectivity and rational thinking.  Larry
>is king in this regard and knows ALL the facts and is not prone
>to making hasty or biased judgements.  I don't think he has a
>biased bone in his body!  He is simply a clear rational thinker
>and is ultimately qualified to evaluate chess programs.
>
>So if Larry said this, I wouldn't bet against it, unless you just
>want to throw your money away, in which case you can just send it
>to me and save yourself the hassle!
>- Don

I have known Larry for over 15 years, and Don, you are
right on the button! Well said.
- Steve (ICD/Your Move)



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