Author: Robert Hyatt
Date: 13:45:38 11/11/98
Go up one level in this thread
On November 11, 1998 at 16:02:35, Hristo wrote: >On November 10, 1998 at 17:27:43, Robert Hyatt wrote: > >>On November 10, 1998 at 10:56:40, Peter Hegger wrote: >> >>>On November 09, 1998 at 14:30:31, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>> >>>>On November 09, 1998 at 12:39:46, odell hall wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>>On November 09, 1998 at 09:21:50, Peter Hegger wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>Hello, My name is Deep Blue >>>>>> >>>>>>Did I ever tell you about the ten game match I played a few years back? >>>>>>Well, I played all the leading micros and made a perfect 10-0 score against >>>>>>them. Wiped them all off the board easily. >>>>>>What? You want to see the games? >>>>>>Oh no sorry, I couldn't possibly do that. >>>>>>You'll just have to take my word for it that it really happened. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>You are exactly right! If the match did in fact happen why haven't they >>>>>published the games? The kasparov match is over so they can't fear that kasparov >>>>>will see the games. What other possible motivation for not revealing the games >>>>>other than that it never occured!! >>>> >>>>If you want to believe that pigs can fly, that there is a free lunch, and that >>>>this match never happened, go right ahead. P.T. Barnum had a comment that fits >>>>really well. >>>> >>>>As to why won't they say anything? After all the obnoxious posts here about >>>>deep blue and how badly it plays and how lucky it was to beat kasparov and >>>>how it can't hold a light to todays micros, maybe, just maybe, they don't give >>>>a damn about what anyone here thinks? Wouldn't blame them in the least... >>>> >>>>Never seen such a bunch of closed minds... of course when something is closed >>>>that tightly, it is *very dark* inside... >>> >>>Quite the contrary. >>>It is because I am looking at the issue with an open mind that I pose the >>>question about the games. >>>For Hsu and Campbell to say that these games were not considered important >>>enough to record strains credibility. >> >> >>Why would this be true? I played a long match vs genius several years ago and >>beat it nearly every game (using a Cray) and with significant time odds to boot. >>I expected to win, I did, and I didn't save a single game score because I didn't >>consider those games particularly remarkable... >> >>I'd suspect Hsu did the same. They told me about the match months after it had >>been done. By the time I reported it the data was gone. What was worth saving? >> >>IE I play new programs on ICC all the time, and they generally lose every game >>for the first few months until they become more "complete." I don't file those >>games away... what would be the reason? > > >Junior, Fritz, Rebel are complete programs not some program X-in-teenage ... if >someone could consistently win against these programs, they should at least >extend the courtesy of showing an example, even if this required to play a set >of new games ... >What is your point Bob ... that gods don't talk to mortals ...?? NO... try this: "researchers don't report mundane results."... IE my son and I go to the river nearly every weekend to race our boat. It runs like a bat and we lose maybe once every couple of months in the local races. I change the compression ratio, run down to the river and race a few guys out tweakint their setups as well... and I run off and leave them every race... because I run off and leave them in real races as well. Do I mention that? No. It isn't news. If Crafty were to thump genius 10 games in a row and do it easily, I would report the games and stuff here. If Cray Blitz did the same I wouldn't, because it isn't exactly "news" that that would happen. Hsu told me about the match months after it had happened. In an idle conversation about the commercial programs and how they might fare against DB. He didn't consider his results remarkable when he played the games... I didn't consider it remarkable when he told me the results... But *we* know what deep blue is capable of. Everyone else wants to hold this jaundiced opinion that the commercial guys are *obviously* better than the DB guys because look what they can do with a micro while DB has all that hardware behind them. Believe it... or don't believe it.. that is your decision. If you'd had the chance to see them play for > 10 years, gotten to look over their shoulder to see what their program was seeing, and compared that to what *your* program could see, this "mystery" would not be a subject of debate any more. Those of us that know, *know*. Those of us that don't, *don't*. And then there are a few that should know but *won't*... That last case is particularly sad. > >I just finished a match crafty15.20 vs MyProgram. The result was >crafty=0:MyProgram=20. However I knew MyProgram would win so I didn't record the >games. ...well I also knew everyone here would be interested ... but what a heck >... perhaps I can pull the logs from crafty ... > > > >hristo
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