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Subject: Re: who does not understand the position(the human or the computer)

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 07:05:35 11/19/03

Go up one level in this thread


On November 19, 2003 at 09:16:14, Uri Blass wrote:

>Here is a position from my last tournament game
>
>
>[D]r4rk1/1ppq1pbp/3p1np1/p2Pp3/2P5/1PNP2Pb/PB3PBP/R2QR1K1 w - - 0 15
>
>Please give your evaluation of the position without chess programs and give the
>move that you like before you read the rest of the post that is some lines
>behind this line.
>
>

I like black slightly.  White's queen-side pawns are a bit inhibited by
the black pawn at h5,  To do anything on the queen-side becomes a bit
slower as a result.  IE I have to play a3 before I play b4.  I need b4
to play c5 and work on that pawn chain.  Also white's king is a bit loose
as if I play Bxh3 as white, black plays Qxh3 and now I am probably going to
have to do something like f3 to make it harder to pile up on h3, or else
Qf3 to get to g2 if black plays Ng4.

I don't see any serious plus or minus other than white's somewhat restricted
queen-side.

Just an opinion.  I then tried it on Crafty and Crafty says "nearly even"
with a score of -.10 roughly.


>
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>I evaluated the position as better for black
>I assumed in that game that I need the white bishop so I played Bh1
>
>It was not a move that I thought much about it because based on previous
>experience I know that it is bad to trade the bishop at g2 and I used more time
>for other moves.
>
>I decided to give the position to Fritz and Fritz evaluates it as equal and
>likes d4
>
>Shredder even prefers the position of white.
>
>Is this an example for the superiority of computers relative to humans in
>understanding positions.
>
>
>[D]r4rk1/1ppq1pbp/3p1np1/p2Pp3/2P5/1PNP2Pb/PB3PBP/R2QR1K1 w - - 0 1
>
>Analysis by Fritz 8:
>
>15.d4!
>  =  (-0.19)   Depth: 6/24   00:00:00  115kN
>15.d4 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 Rfe8 17.dxe5 dxe5 18.Ne4 Nxe4 19.Rxe4 Qf5
>  ³  (-0.31)   Depth: 7/23   00:00:00  176kN
>15.Bf3!
>  ³  (-0.28)   Depth: 7/23   00:00:00  188kN
>15.Bf3 Rfe8 16.Qe2 h6 17.Ne4 Nxe4 18.Qxe4 Qf5
>  =  (-0.22)   Depth: 7/23   00:00:00  219kN
>15.Bf3 Rfe8 16.Qe2 h6 17.Ne4 Nxe4 18.dxe4 a4 19.b4
>  ³  (-0.28)   Depth: 8/24   00:00:00  312kN
>15.Qf3!
>  =  (-0.25)   Depth: 8/24   00:00:01  345kN
>15.Qf3 h6 16.a3 Rfe8 17.Bxh3 Qxh3 18.Ne4 Nxe4 19.dxe4 a4
>  =  (-0.22)   Depth: 8/24   00:00:01  410kN
>15.Qf3 h6 16.Bc1 Bxg2 17.Qxg2 Ng4 18.f3 e4 19.fxg4 Bxc3 20.Bxh6
>  =  (-0.19)   Depth: 9/36   00:00:02  927kN
>15.d4!
>  =  (-0.16)   Depth: 9/36   00:00:04  1435kN
>15.d4 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 Rfe8 17.Qf3 h6 18.dxe5 dxe5 19.Ne4 Nxe4 20.Qxe4 f5 21.Qe3
>  =  (-0.09)   Depth: 10/31   00:00:08  3284kN
>15.d4 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 Rfe8 17.Qf3 h6 18.dxe5 dxe5 19.h3 Rad8 20.Ne4 Nxe4 21.Qxe4 c6
>  =  (0.00)   Depth: 11/37   00:00:19  7819kN
>15.d4 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 Rfe8 17.dxe5 Rxe5 18.Rxe5 dxe5 19.Qf3 Re8 20.Re1 h6 21.Ne4
>Nxe4 22.Qxe4 c6
>  =  (-0.06)   Depth: 12/33   00:00:36  14728kN
>15.d4 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 Rfe8 17.dxe5 Rxe5 18.Rxe5 dxe5 19.Qf3 Re8 20.Re1 h6 21.Ne4
>Nxe4 22.Qxe4
>  =  (-0.03)   Depth: 13/36   00:01:33  39735kN
>15.d4 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 Rfe8 17.dxe5 Rxe5 18.Rxe5 dxe5 19.Qf3 Re8 20.Re1 h6 21.h3 c6
>22.dxc6
>  =  (0.03)   Depth: 14/41   00:04:45  121046kN
>
>(Blass, Tel-Aviv 19.11.2003)
>
>
>New game - Junior 7
>r4rk1/1ppq1pbp/3p1np1/p2Pp3/2P5/1PNP2Pb/PB3PBP/R2QR1K1 w - - 0 1
>
>Analysis by Shredder 7.04:
>
>15.Qf3 Bxg2 16.Qxg2
>  =  (0.09)   Depth: 1/5   00:00:00
>15.Qf3 Bxg2 16.Qxg2
>  =  (0.09)   Depth: 1/5   00:00:00
>15.Qf3 Bxg2 16.Qxg2
>  =  (0.09)   Depth: 1/5   00:00:00
>15.Qf3 Bxg2 16.Qxg2
>  =  (0.09)   Depth: 1/5   00:00:00
>15.Qf3 Bxg2 16.Qxg2
>  =  (0.09)   Depth: 1/5   00:00:00
>15.Qf3 Bxg2 16.Qxg2
>  =  (0.09)   Depth: 1/5   00:00:00
>15.Qf3 Bxg2 16.Qxg2
>  =  (0.09)   Depth: 2/5   00:00:00
>15.Qf3 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 c6
>  =  (-0.05)   Depth: 3/8   00:00:00
>15.Qf3 Bg4 16.Qe3 Qf5
>  =  (-0.03)   Depth: 4/10   00:00:00
>15.Qf3 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 Rac8 17.h3 c6
>  =  (0.01)   Depth: 5/13   00:00:00
>15.d4 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 Qf5 17.dxe5 Qh3+ 18.Kxh3
>  =  (0.02)   Depth: 5/13   00:00:00
>15.d4 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 Rae8 17.dxe5 Rxe5 18.Kg1
>  =  (0.16)   Depth: 5/19   00:00:00
>15.d4 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 exd4 17.Qxd4 Rae8 18.Ne4 Re5
>  =  (0.17)   Depth: 6/19   00:00:00  27kN
>15.d4 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 Rae8 17.dxe5 Rxe5 18.Rxe5 dxe5 19.f3 c6 20.dxc6 Qxc6
>  =  (0.15)   Depth: 7/19   00:00:00  67kN
>15.d4 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 exd4 17.Qxd4 Ng4 18.Qf4 Be5 19.Qf3 Rae8
>  =  (0.08)   Depth: 8/20   00:00:01  192kN
>15.d4 exd4 16.Qxd4 Ng4 17.Qf4 Bxg2 18.Kxg2 Be5 19.Qf3 Bd4 20.Qf4 Bxf2
>  =  (0.19)   Depth: 9/21   00:00:03  448kN
>15.d4 exd4 16.Qxd4 Ng4 17.Qd2 Bxg2 18.Kxg2 Rfe8 19.h3 Bxc3 20.Bxc3 Ne5 21.Bxe5
>Qxh3+ 22.Kxh3
>  ²  (0.29)   Depth: 10/25   00:00:07  982kN
>15.d4 exd4 16.Qxd4 Ng4 17.Qd2 Bxg2 18.Kxg2 Qf5 19.h3 Ne5 20.f4 Nd3 21.Re7 Nxb2
>22.Qxb2
>  ²  (0.38)   Depth: 11/31   00:00:16  2399kN
>15.d4 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 Rae8 17.dxe5 Rxe5 18.Rxe5 dxe5 19.Qf3 Ne8 20.Ne4 f5 21.Nc5 e4
>22.Qe2 Qc8 23.Ne6
>  ²  (0.47)   Depth: 12/34   00:00:53  7722kN
>15.d4 Bxg2 16.Kxg2 Rfe8 17.dxe5 Rxe5 18.Rxe5 dxe5 19.Qf3 Nh5 20.Qe3 f5 21.f3 f4
>22.Qc5 Bf8 23.Qb5
>  ²  (0.46)   Depth: 13/34   00:01:51  16322kN
>
>(Blass, Tel-Aviv 19.11.2003)



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