Author: Uri Blass
Date: 15:46:21 11/21/03
Go up one level in this thread
On November 21, 2003 at 17:52:16, Robert Hyatt wrote: >On November 21, 2003 at 10:35:20, Uri Blass wrote: > >>On November 21, 2003 at 10:25:25, Robert Hyatt wrote: >> >>>On November 21, 2003 at 09:39:35, Uri Blass wrote: >>> >>>>On November 21, 2003 at 08:43:28, Matthew Hull wrote: >>>> >>>>>On November 21, 2003 at 05:32:12, Amir Ban wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>On November 20, 2003 at 23:57:50, Russell Reagan wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>On November 20, 2003 at 19:21:56, Amir Ban wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>I guess if Crafty were given knight odds it would also have a fair chance at >>>>>>>>winning, but what exactly does that prove ? >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Come on Amir... >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Do you really believe that winning the WCCC with superior hardware is on par >>>>>>>with winning the WCCC when given knight odds? >>>>>>> >>>>>>>I thought the WCCC was about finding out what was the best chess playing >>>>>>>computer, hardware and software combination. >>>>>> >>>>>>Bob didn't say "I can get better hardware than you guys". He said "If I come >>>>>>with big hardware and you don't, I can beat you". >>>>>> >>>>>>This is the same as needing a handicap to compete. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>Is it the World Computer Chess Championship or not? It's not the World Software >>>>>Chess Championship. >>>>> >>>>>If it runs on a computer, then there is no issue of handicaps. >>>>> >>>>>Your attempt at obfuscation is exposed. :) >>>>> >>>>>Matt >>>> >>>>No >>>> >>>>Bob did not suggest that everyone use the best hardware but that Crafty will use >>>>the best hardware that it can use when Junior is using only one cpu inspite of >>>>the fact that it is able to use better hardware with more than one processor. >>>> >>> >>>I didn't suggest a _thing_ about what hardware Junior should use. Why, exactly, >>>do you think Amir is doing a parallel search? Do you suppose it has _anything_ >>>to do with obtaining a hardware advantage? >>> >>> >>>>What Bob suggested is giving Crafty an unfair advantage and not trying to find >>>>the best combination of software and hardware. >>> >>>I didn't suggest any such thing. I answered the question "what US program >>>would be competitive in this year's WCCC event." Crafty on good hardware >>>is more than "just competitive" and that's _all_ I said. You have _never_ >>>heard me complain about what hardware others have used in the past. Since >>>my Cray days I have never shown up at a chess tournament with "the best >>>hardware". Not even at the WMCCC events I have played in. And I didn't >>>complain one bit that my hardware was slower. That's part of the events, >>>IMHO. That's why this is called "computer chess". Otherwise we could >>>all take our algorithms, sit down with pencil and paper and simulate games >>>as was done in the early 1950's, and see which _algorithm_ is best. >> >>You did not mention the word Junior but you clearly suggest to have the top >>commercial programs on a single CPU box >> >>Here are your words: >> >>"If you take the top commercial programs running on a single CPU box, and >>Crafty running on a big Opteron box, I'd claim Crafty has at _least_ as good >>a chance of winning as any one-cpu program, and probably better chances." >> >> >>The top commercial programs do not play on a single CPU box and this is the >>point. > >_wrong_. > >Hiarcs is a top commercial program. It only uses one cpu. > >Rebel is a top commercial program. It only uses one cpu. > >Tiger is a top commercial program. It only uses one cpu. > >ChessMaster is a top commercial program. It only uses one CPU. > >Mchess is a top commercial program. It only uses one CPU. > >Need I go farther? None of them compete in this WCCC I also think that at least part of them are not considered as top commercial programs Fritz and Junior and Shredder are simply better even with one processor. > >The original question was, simply put "What US program would be competitive." >The answer was "Crafty on big hardware." It is depdent on the definition of competitive but I think that even in that case Junior or Shredder with their hardware have better chances to win. Uri
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